[hackerspaces] Working on setting up my space

Thu Oct 22 19:04:54 CEST 2009

I think we want a 501c3, but my accountant thinks it may fit another c
better.  I'm just looking for the supporting Docs to show my account how
other people have done it, I don't think she understands.

Also I think hackerspaces are defined by their local community as to what
they are or are not, and that can change overtime.

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 12:58 PM, Adam D Bachman <adam.bachman at gmail.com>wrote:

> I stand corrected. It was not my intention to forcefully modify your
> meaning. I should've said, "what I'm hearing is, ...". I was seeking
> clarification on what seemed like a strict interpretation of Hackerspace
> doctrine (which we're both aware doesn't actually exist).
> > Tom hasn't stated what he's doing yet. So please no snap judgements
>
> That was my point, too. I think we're on the same page.
>
> > he will have problems getting certain types of funding if his focus is on
> education
>
> I (and to my knowledge, B'more Node) haven't pursued direct funding from
> charitable organizations, so I don't have experience in this area. Do you
> mean that if he has a focus on education and *is* a 501c3 he will have
> problems, or has a focus on education and *is not* a 501c3 he will have
> problems?
>
> > if people are respectful of each other and improve the community around
> them through collaboration of these things that they are a hackerspace or
> not
>
> Yes. This is pretty simply what I believe "hackerspace" to mean. Our bylaws
> say, "Baltimore Node Corporation seeks to create and sustain an
> environment that promotes the creative use of technology for the benefit of
> art, science and culture." and we go about that by (paraphrased)
> "establishing and maintaining a physical space, supporting a nurturing
> community of makers devoted to education and collaboration, empowering
> members to create, experiment and invent; encouraging and supporting the
> sharing of research; and actively engaging with the community." -
> http://wiki.baltimorenode.org/index.php?title=Bylaws
>
> My point was that IRS considerations (especially since they're strictly USA
> centered) don't have anything to do with what is or isn't a hackerspace.
>
> My apologies, again, for jumping before you said "boo".
>
>
> - Adam
>
>
> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 12:45 PM, Eric Michaud <michaud.eric.c at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> This also only applies to US tax law, I can't comment on other countries.
>>
>>
>>  On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Eric Michaud <michaud.eric.c at gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>>
>>> I didn't say he wouldn't be one of them because of those, but it's hard
>>> to show the shades of we're doing this because of X. There are many flavors,
>>> but the main thing is what are you focusing on. Are you aiming to be a Tech
>>> Shop? or something else? What also becomes difficult is if we want to share
>>> assets with another group. It's not as trivial to do so. As PSOne is filing
>>> ours shortly we found out a lot of other groups not including grant writers
>>> don't want to donate equipment or services to other groups because they
>>> either A don't know how to handle it, or B the appearance to others as to
>>> who they donated for is not a straight up traditional thought of
>>> Not-For-Profit 501c3.
>>>
>>> Also Adam please don't paraphrase what I said. That is incorrect.
>>>
>>> I stated.
>>>
>>> " If that is not the case your not really being a hackerspace since the
>>> main focus is on educating the many and sharing tools."
>>>
>>> Three things
>>>
>>> Tom may have a very excellent reason for what he's doing.  Tom hasn't
>>> stated what he's doing yet. So please no snap judgements.
>>>
>>> The next thing is I said what I said because there are a lot of place
>>> calling themselves hackerspaces when they are clearly not.  I wanted to make
>>> sure he knows that he will have problems getting certain types of funding if
>>> his focus is on education. Regardless of what form his group takes.
>>>
>>> The third point is being a hackerspace is about sharing
>>> knowledge(education) and resources(tools or otherwise) with the community on
>>> a very basic level. Do you not agree with this that if people are respectful
>>> of each other and improve the community around them through collaboration of
>>> these things that they are a hackerspace or not?
>>>
>>> Adam I agree with you that you don't have to be a 501c3 to be a
>>> hackerspace, I don't know where your getting that idea from. Please don't
>>> misinterpret what I'm stating is all.
>>>
>>> I wanted to get it out that I'm not telling everyone what one is or isn't
>>> but that Tom might have problems arising later in collaborating with certain
>>> groups. It's like the GPLv2 and GPLv3. How many issues came up with
>>> licensing alone when GPLv3 came online as a tool for software licensing.
>>>
>>>
>>> Cheers,
>>>
>>> -Eric.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Adam D Bachman <adam.bachman at gmail.com
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> >  If that is not the case your not really being a hackerspace since
>>>> the main focus is on educating the many and sharing tools.
>>>>
>>>> That sounds like a false dichotomy. "Be a 501c3 and pursue MacArthur
>>>> grants" (be one of us?) or "you're not a hackerspace".
>>>>
>>>> While I agree that going down another of the 501 roads might be a waste
>>>> of time, I wouldn't suggest they're traitors to the cause.
>>>>
>>>> We at Baltimore Node haven't pursued 501c3 status because of the expense
>>>> and because there's no immediate need for the status*. We're definitely
>>>> still a hackerspace, though.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> - Adam Bachman
>>>> http://baltimorenode.org
>>>>
>>>> * - I should note that I'm indifferent to our tax exempt status since my
>>>> contributions aren't enough to justify itemizing on my tax returns, so I'm
>>>> not going to pursue it. When someone sees the need clearly and is willing to
>>>> act on it, though, it will get done.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Eric Michaud <
>>>> michaud.eric.c at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Sorry, I meant to state  before I accidentally clicked send. Why are
>>>>> you not doing 501c3? Since c6 is for Recreational groups., and c7 is focused
>>>>> on groups for lobbying.
>>>>>
>>>>> You wouldn't be able to get grants as easily at all. if your looking
>>>>> for stuff from MacArthur, NSF, or a number of other educational groups. If
>>>>> that is not the case your not really being a hackerspace since the main
>>>>> focus is on educating the many and sharing tools.
>>>>>
>>>>> Also which state are you in?
>>>>>
>>>>> I'd also love to talk shop with you about this if you'd like.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Eric Michaud <
>>>>> michaud.eric.c at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hey Tim, why are your leanings to the other groups instead of just
>>>>>> 501c3? or c7? Are you planning to not be community oriented or lobby
>>>>>> congress?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 10:19 AM, Tim Krabec <tkrabec at gmail.com>wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Id like to get a copy of some one's IRS Form1023, my accountant is
>>>>>>> leaning towards a 501c6 or c7 vs the c3.  I'd like to get more info to her.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tim
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> Discuss mailing list
>>>>>>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
>>>>>>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Discuss mailing list
>>>>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>
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>
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-- 
Tim Krabec
Kracomp
772-597-2349
smbminute.com
kracomp.blogspot.com
www.kracomp.com
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