[SpaceProgram] Fwd: Space Farmers: LEDs As Key To NASA's Permanent Lunar Life Support - Forbes

Wed Sep 5 12:04:11 CEST 2012

I think we should discriminate between growing algae and growing plants.
You need different wavelengths and outputs for different organisms. So
although LEDs can be a great choice IMHO for algae, it might not be the
best solution for plants. This company for instance sells LEDs as algae
growth boosters: http://www.lumigrow.com/products/es-330-led-grow-light/

And yes, adding flavours and vitamins would be my goal too when engineering
algae.

On 5 September 2012 03:54, cole santos <cksantos85 at gmail.com> wrote:

> Cheap LEDs cannot penetrate the leaf and therefore do no initialize
> photosynthesis (ideal >1-3 watts per led). All decent led grow lights use
> at least 3 spectrum simultaneously some are up to 7 now. Why did you want
> to expose different spectrum at different times? Its cheaper to buy them
> built than individual LEDs, due to volume purchasing. Alibaba has a huge
> number of vendors, use reviews to discriminate. LEDs are subject to moores
> law type paradigm so if you need them cheaper best thing to do is wait. As
> soon as they are more common in home lights instead of cfl then you know
> its not going to get much cheaper than that.
>
>
> On Wed, Sep 5, 2012 at 1:29 PM, Matt Joyce <matt at nycresistor.com> wrote:
>
>> There are many different leds producing many wonderful wavelengths of
>> luminescence.  I think the goal was to use multiple arrays of
>> different LEDs and rotate them around the plant exposing them to
>> multiple sets of light at different wavelengths over time.  Not sure
>> why that specifically was wanted.  I just assumed it was a cost thing.
>>  Cheap LEDs are cheap.  Figure out a way to use cheap leds to do the
>> job of expensive LEDs at scale... etc.
>>
>> I could have been completely mad in thinking that.
>>
>> -Matt
>>
>> On Tue, Sep 4, 2012 at 4:12 PM, cole santos <cksantos85 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Would be nice to gmo chlorella to produce flavanoids that make it taste
>> > better and add genes for more nutrient production.
>> >
>> >
>> > On Wed, Sep 5, 2012 at 1:07 PM, cole santos <cksantos85 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> Why use a rotating array? Your plants will quickly outgrow such a small
>> >> area. Make sure to use at least 3w leds or you wont get enough canopy
>> >> penetration. Also you need UV for vitamin d production which cannot be
>> >> produced by leds...for now. Check out plasma lighting, more efficient
>> that
>> >> LED. For hydroponics I am working on integrating organic nutrient
>> sources
>> >> such as fish effluent, biogas effluent, and human waste products. For
>> space
>> >> applications we need aeroponics to reduce total required water volume.
>> To do
>> >> aeroponics with organic nutrient sources you need an atomizer that
>> doesn't
>> >> clog. Looking into centrifugal atomizers atm. But in reality food
>> production
>> >> is a luxury when you can eat chlorella exclusively. Chlorella is easy
>> to
>> >> grow and is the most efficient method of co2 removal and o2 production
>> by
>> >> volume of area required. Hence my algae reactor project.
>> >>
>> >> On Wed, Sep 5, 2012 at 11:30 AM, Matt Joyce <matt at nycresistor.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Some folks at NYC Resistor were working on a growing apparatus using a
>> >>> rotating array of leds operating at different wavelengths.
>> >>>
>> >>> pic of it... behind and to the left ( looking at me ) of my glorious
>> >>> visage.
>> >>>
>> >>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/openfly/7558683614/
>> >>>
>> >>> I'd love to see something like a git project setup for space based
>> >>> growing testing kits.
>> >>>
>> >>> Throw in some STL / code / eagle etc for some citizen science style
>> >>> testing.... aka repeatable experimentation.  And we have some real
>> >>> live testing of procedures for open source scientific research into
>> >>> how to grow stuff in hazardous areas safely.
>> >>>
>> >>> I think that would be a great easy enough project to get into.  And it
>> >>> would probably iron out some of the kinks in getting a bunch of people
>> >>> to be able to contribute to a much larger goal.
>> >>>
>> >>> -Matt
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Tue, Sep 4, 2012 at 2:25 PM, cole santos <cksantos85 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>> > I have nothing running ATM but I did a lot of monoculture algae work
>> >>> > when I
>> >>> > was in aquaculture program at UH
>> >>> >
>> >>> >
>> >>> >
>> http://contrails.iit.edu/DigitalCollection/1962/AMRLTDR62-116article03.pdf
>> >>> >
>> >>> > This is where I got my ideas.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > My test reactor is going to be 18" x 24" x .2"
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Man sized reactor will be 24" x 48" x .2-.09 with ~20 of them in
>> >>> > parallel.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Algae will be extracted via this device.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > http://www.parc.com/services/focus-area/clean-water/
>> >>> >
>> >>> > and o2 / co2 / vox will be monitored by sensors on arduino control.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Short term plan is to replicate the boeing experiment and adapt for
>> >>> > longer
>> >>> > term production
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Longer term, utilizing human wastewater as a nutrient supply and
>> >>> > electricity
>> >>> > source with waterwater fuel cells.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Each project is part of a larger plan for a compact biological
>> closed
>> >>> > cycle
>> >>> > habitat.
>> >>> >
>> >>> >
>> >>> >
>> >>> >
>> >>> >
>> >>> > On Wed, Sep 5, 2012 at 11:10 AM, Máté Ravasz <
>> ravaszmeister at gmail.com>
>> >>> > wrote:
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Hi,
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> I've just started to build up my own algae cultures at home last
>> >>> >> month.
>> >>> >> Seeing your post on how far you've progressed already in this, I
>> >>> >> immediately
>> >>> >> became jealous. Would you by any chance have any publicly available
>> >>> >> data on
>> >>> >> how your setup runs? I am building a sunlight powered reactor at
>> the
>> >>> >> moment,
>> >>> >> but I would be eager to read up on more advanced methods if
>> possible.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> Thanks for any info,
>> >>> >> Mat
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> On 4 September 2012 22:48, cole santos <cksantos85 at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>> For big area lighting plasma is more efficient than leds.
>> >>> >>> http://www.plasma-i.com/index.html
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>> On Wed, Sep 5, 2012 at 10:46 AM, cole santos <
>> cksantos85 at gmail.com>
>> >>> >>> wrote:
>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>> LED's are more expensive than florescents...and that is after
>> order
>> >>> >>>> of
>> >>> >>>> magnitude reductions in cost over the last few years. I found
>> some
>> >>> >>>> vendors
>> >>> >>>> in china for LED lights. Florescent technology requires bulb
>> changes
>> >>> >>>> every 6
>> >>> >>>> months to a year, this makes it unworkable for space, but good
>> for
>> >>> >>>> earth
>> >>> >>>> testing. LED research on optimal spectrum for algae growth is an
>> >>> >>>> open
>> >>> >>>> research field. Another problem is the design for my algae
>> reactors
>> >>> >>>> needs
>> >>> >>>> lights that are 360, but leds are about 130 deg. a bi directional
>> >>> >>>> light
>> >>> >>>> would cost a lot more due to custom nature of such a light,
>> another
>> >>> >>>> option
>> >>> >>>> is to just stack 2 lights back to back... but now you've doubled
>> you
>> >>> >>>> costs
>> >>> >>>> and lighting is more that 50% of the total cost.
>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>> On Wed, Sep 5, 2012 at 10:25 AM, Jerry Isdale <isdale at gmail.com>
>> >>> >>>> wrote:
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>> Growing in space requires light. Space stations may be able to
>> >>> >>>>> orient
>> >>> >>>>> themselves for full time growing but Colonies on moons, etc will
>> >>> >>>>> need some
>> >>> >>>>> power source for when their rotation takes them into night (moon
>> >>> >>>>> night = 2
>> >>> >>>>> weeks).
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>> This article talks about using LEDs powered from a small nuclear
>> >>> >>>>> power
>> >>> >>>>> source, similar to that powering the Curiosity Rover.
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>>
>> http://www.forbes.com/sites/brucedorminey/2012/08/31/space-farmers-leds-as-key-to-nasas-permanent-lunar-life-support/
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>> Jerry Isdale
>> >>> >>>>> isdale at gmail.com
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>>
>> >>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
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>> >>> >>>>
>> >>> >>>
>> >>> >>>
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