[hackerspaces] Soldering and safety?
Ross Mukai
rossmukai at gmail.com
Thu May 16 03:55:19 CEST 2013
The rosin core is the smoke that you see. Even though it is not burning hot enough to vaporize lead, it does carry lead particulate.
The rosin itself is processed out of pine sap, so it's very similar to turpentine. Burning it does have health risks. I have heard that the rosin used in lead-free solder is more toxic. It isn't something you want floating around, settling, and accumulating all over the inside of your space.
Either way, it will be more of a hazard for long term exposure. People who are regularly in the space where soldering happens often should be the most concerned about it. At the very least, a fume hood says "we care" to the inexperienced, who may overestimate the risks in their head.
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 11:14:48 -0400
> From: David Brightbill <david.brightbill at gmail.com>
> To: "discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org" <discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org>
> Subject: [hackerspaces] Soldering and safety?
> Message-ID:
> <CAG0DV5b9JR0KX7W54TEYkPWpQf8yRCOY0C7krTvyuqagTE3-gw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I'm a safety-third kind of guy in my personal life but as a board member of
> a space, I worry about liability etc. Recently, during a soldering class,
> the topic of soldering fume extractors came up. What's the take on these?
> Should we buy or make some, or is this overkill for the application?
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> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 11:24:54 -0400
> From: Sparr <sparr0 at gmail.com>
> To: Hackerspaces General Discussion List
> <discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org>
> Subject: Re: [hackerspaces] Soldering and safety?
> Message-ID:
> <CANp3UNCKY0cve0BDfOms+NfvxF3FT=cDNXLD4o21hJ5VR=Ukzg at mail.gmail.com>
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>
> They are so trivial to make that there's little reason to not have
> them. A 12V wall wart, a switch, a 12V case fan, a simple filter, and
> some coat hanger wire to hold it all together and give it legs.
>
> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 11:14 AM, David Brightbill
> <david.brightbill at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I'm a safety-third kind of guy in my personal life but as a board member of
>> a space, I worry about liability etc. Recently, during a soldering class,
>> the topic of soldering fume extractors came up. What's the take on these?
>> Should we buy or make some, or is this overkill for the application?
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 11:52:28 -0400
> From: dosman <dosman at packetsniffers.org>
> To: Hackerspaces General Discussion List
> <discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org>
> Subject: Re: [hackerspaces] Soldering and safety?
> Message-ID: <9C23EA49-01D6-4F16-B17B-A3C58B28ABF0 at packetsniffers.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> The smoke is from the rosin core so it's not like it's lead smoke, although that doesn't mean it's not harmful in any way. The fume extractors are just a pleasantry to keep smoke out of your eyes, I highly doubt they have any actual health benefit as they don't have HEPA filters in them. But if they help and make people feel better then there's nothing wrong with them.
>
> -dosman
>
>
> On May 15, 2013, at 11:14 AM, David Brightbill wrote:
>
>> I'm a safety-third kind of guy in my personal life but as a board member of a space, I worry about liability etc. Recently, during a soldering class, the topic of soldering fume extractors came up. What's the take on these? Should we buy or make some, or is this overkill for the application?
>> _______________________________________________
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 11:04:06 -0500
> From: Pete Prodoehl <raster at gmail.com>
> To: Hackerspaces General Discussion List
> <discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org>
> Subject: Re: [hackerspaces] Soldering and safety?
> Message-ID: <5193B1F6.2010705 at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=UTF-8; format=flowed
>
>
> At a minimum, a well-ventilated area should be used, add in a small fan
> to blow the fumes away from your face and that should do.
>
> If it's a simple intro class, people learning won't be spending hours
> soldering, will they?
>
>
> Pete
>
>
> On 5/15/13 10:52 AM, dosman wrote:
>> The smoke is from the rosin core so it's not like it's lead smoke, although that doesn't mean it's not harmful in any way. The fume extractors are just a pleasantry to keep smoke out of your eyes, I highly doubt they have any actual health benefit as they don't have HEPA filters in them. But if they help and make people feel better then there's nothing wrong with them.
>>
>> -dosman
>>
>>
>> On May 15, 2013, at 11:14 AM, David Brightbill wrote:
>>
>>> I'm a safety-third kind of guy in my personal life but as a board member of a space, I worry about liability etc. Recently, during a soldering class, the topic of soldering fume extractors came up. What's the take on these? Should we buy or make some, or is this overkill for the application?
>>> _____________________________________________
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 11:04:37 -0500
> From: Chris Weiss <cweiss at gmail.com>
> To: Hackerspaces General Discussion List
> <discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org>
> Subject: Re: [hackerspaces] Soldering and safety?
> Message-ID:
> <CAEhO07NoHodUaEeq9aVsJyMqT9CAwqY0T54Os3_LfOTDTj_NSQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> http://www.sentryair.com/solder%20fume.htm
>
> keep in mind that page is basically an advertisement targeted at
> companies with employees that spend hours on end day after day with an
> iron in hand. Terms like "excessive exposure" don't even come into
> play with a 2 hours class once a week. "excessive" would be more like
> "shut this guy a room with no ventilation at all".
>
> however, as stated already, a cheap and easy to make "extractor" is
> worth the effort, even if only for the convenience of not having smoke
> in your face.
>
> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 10:14 AM, David Brightbill
> <david.brightbill at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I'm a safety-third kind of guy in my personal life but as a board member of
>> a space, I worry about liability etc. Recently, during a soldering class,
>> the topic of soldering fume extractors came up. What's the take on these?
>> Should we buy or make some, or is this overkill for the application?
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 22:29:08 +0200
> From: Felicitus <felicitus at felicitus.org>
> To: discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
> Subject: Re: [hackerspaces] Soldering and safety?
> Message-ID: <5193F014.4090101 at felicitus.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
>
> On 05/15/2013 05:14 PM, David Brightbill wrote:
>> I'm a safety-third kind of guy in my personal life but as a board member
>> of a space, I worry about liability etc. Recently, during a soldering
>> class, the topic of soldering fume extractors came up. What's the take
>> on these? Should we buy or make some, or is this overkill for the
>> application?
>
> tl;dr:
> Attach signs which say: "Wash your hands after soldering" prior to
> buying fume extractors.
>
> Long Version:
>
> Most of the fume you'll encounter while soldering is due to vaporizing
> the flux, not the solder itself (lead vaporizes at about 1700?C, there's
> no way you could ever vaporize solder with your regular soldering iron).
> So your agenda is:
>
> 1) Instruct people to wash their hands
>
> People at our hackerspace rarely do it, including myself. I try to do
> it, but it's easy to forget. And I forgot to put up such a sign so many
> times (added to my calendar now ;)).
>
> But even if you don't wash your hands, it's very unlikely that you
> absorb an amount of lead that will cause health issues. I have no
> numbers and no research done on this; so if in doubt, do your own research.
>
> 2) Invest into fume extractors
>
> That's something you could do, but often isn't done, simply because it
> isn't super-effective unless you buy some of those heavy-duty fume
> extractors which sits right above the place you're about to solder
> (typically 5-10cm, and typically it's in the way) [1].
>
> Those smaller ones which sit about 20-30cm away [2] still reduce fume
> "pollution", however, they aren't as effective as the heavy ones.
>
> Neither of those will stop fume. It will be there. But fume isn't as
> dangerous as the public believes, and efficiency of those fume
> extractors is much less than you'd expect.
>
> Suggestion: Buy one, and leave it up to your members to use it.
>
> All of the above is based on my personal knowledge and experiences, so
> don't solder me down on this. I hope that helps!
>
> Felicitus
>
>
> [1]
> http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00oCFtkHYgEsqy/Welding-Fume-Extractor.jpg
> [2] http://www.elexp.com/solder/456DLX.jpg
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 17:43:48 -0500
> From: Derek Hubbard <dh405okc at gmail.com>
> To: Hackerspaces General Discussion List
> <discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org>
> Cc: "discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org" <discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org>
> Subject: Re: [hackerspaces] Soldering and safety?
> Message-ID: <41FED818-5F5D-4873-8180-28FB573F5F3A at gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8
>
> If the point is to get the smoke away from you, a small desk fan does the trick quite well. That, or do what I've always done and just whistle while you solder.
>
> -Derek Hubbard.
>
> On May 15, 2013, at 3:29 PM, Felicitus <felicitus at felicitus.org> wrote:
>
>> On 05/15/2013 05:14 PM, David Brightbill wrote:
>>> I'm a safety-third kind of guy in my personal life but as a board member
>>> of a space, I worry about liability etc. Recently, during a soldering
>>> class, the topic of soldering fume extractors came up. What's the take
>>> on these? Should we buy or make some, or is this overkill for the
>>> application?
>>
>> tl;dr:
>> Attach signs which say: "Wash your hands after soldering" prior to
>> buying fume extractors.
>>
>> Long Version:
>>
>> Most of the fume you'll encounter while soldering is due to vaporizing
>> the flux, not the solder itself (lead vaporizes at about 1700?C, there's
>> no way you could ever vaporize solder with your regular soldering iron).
>> So your agenda is:
>>
>> 1) Instruct people to wash their hands
>>
>> People at our hackerspace rarely do it, including myself. I try to do
>> it, but it's easy to forget. And I forgot to put up such a sign so many
>> times (added to my calendar now ;)).
>>
>> But even if you don't wash your hands, it's very unlikely that you
>> absorb an amount of lead that will cause health issues. I have no
>> numbers and no research done on this; so if in doubt, do your own research.
>>
>> 2) Invest into fume extractors
>>
>> That's something you could do, but often isn't done, simply because it
>> isn't super-effective unless you buy some of those heavy-duty fume
>> extractors which sits right above the place you're about to solder
>> (typically 5-10cm, and typically it's in the way) [1].
>>
>> Those smaller ones which sit about 20-30cm away [2] still reduce fume
>> "pollution", however, they aren't as effective as the heavy ones.
>>
>> Neither of those will stop fume. It will be there. But fume isn't as
>> dangerous as the public believes, and efficiency of those fume
>> extractors is much less than you'd expect.
>>
>> Suggestion: Buy one, and leave it up to your members to use it.
>>
>> All of the above is based on my personal knowledge and experiences, so
>> don't solder me down on this. I hope that helps!
>>
>> Felicitus
>>
>>
>> [1]
>> http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00oCFtkHYgEsqy/Welding-Fume-Extractor.jpg
>> [2] http://www.elexp.com/solder/456DLX.jpg
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Wed, 15 May 2013 21:07:44 -0400
> From: William Macfarlane <wmacfarl at gmail.com>
> To: Hackerspaces General Discussion List
> <discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org>
> Subject: Re: [hackerspaces] Soldering and safety?
> Message-ID:
> <CAN0yGCBX4eZqRmoJ9THMseYVRauF8WkApifQaFvdjpLAd0ViWQ at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"
>
> The danger of inhaling solder smoke is just the danger of inhaling smoke --
> particles are bad for your lungs, but not catastrophically so. Try to
> avoid inhaling the fumes. Ventilation is best. Fume extractors are second
> best.
>
> And, yeah, of course, wash your hands.
>
> And remember that growing bodies are generally more fragile than grown ones.
>
>
> On Wed, May 15, 2013 at 6:43 PM, Derek Hubbard <dh405okc at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> If the point is to get the smoke away from you, a small desk fan does the
>> trick quite well. That, or do what I've always done and just whistle while
>> you solder.
>>
>> -Derek Hubbard.
>>
>> On May 15, 2013, at 3:29 PM, Felicitus <felicitus at felicitus.org> wrote:
>>
>>> On 05/15/2013 05:14 PM, David Brightbill wrote:
>>>> I'm a safety-third kind of guy in my personal life but as a board member
>>>> of a space, I worry about liability etc. Recently, during a soldering
>>>> class, the topic of soldering fume extractors came up. What's the take
>>>> on these? Should we buy or make some, or is this overkill for the
>>>> application?
>>>
>>> tl;dr:
>>> Attach signs which say: "Wash your hands after soldering" prior to
>>> buying fume extractors.
>>>
>>> Long Version:
>>>
>>> Most of the fume you'll encounter while soldering is due to vaporizing
>>> the flux, not the solder itself (lead vaporizes at about 1700?C, there's
>>> no way you could ever vaporize solder with your regular soldering iron).
>>> So your agenda is:
>>>
>>> 1) Instruct people to wash their hands
>>>
>>> People at our hackerspace rarely do it, including myself. I try to do
>>> it, but it's easy to forget. And I forgot to put up such a sign so many
>>> times (added to my calendar now ;)).
>>>
>>> But even if you don't wash your hands, it's very unlikely that you
>>> absorb an amount of lead that will cause health issues. I have no
>>> numbers and no research done on this; so if in doubt, do your own
>> research.
>>>
>>> 2) Invest into fume extractors
>>>
>>> That's something you could do, but often isn't done, simply because it
>>> isn't super-effective unless you buy some of those heavy-duty fume
>>> extractors which sits right above the place you're about to solder
>>> (typically 5-10cm, and typically it's in the way) [1].
>>>
>>> Those smaller ones which sit about 20-30cm away [2] still reduce fume
>>> "pollution", however, they aren't as effective as the heavy ones.
>>>
>>> Neither of those will stop fume. It will be there. But fume isn't as
>>> dangerous as the public believes, and efficiency of those fume
>>> extractors is much less than you'd expect.
>>>
>>> Suggestion: Buy one, and leave it up to your members to use it.
>>>
>>> All of the above is based on my personal knowledge and experiences, so
>>> don't solder me down on this. I hope that helps!
>>>
>>> Felicitus
>>>
>>>
>>> [1]
>>>
>> http://image.made-in-china.com/2f0j00oCFtkHYgEsqy/Welding-Fume-Extractor.jpg
>>> [2] http://www.elexp.com/solder/456DLX.jpg
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Discuss mailing list
>>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
>>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>> _______________________________________________
>> Discuss mailing list
>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>>
>
>
>
> --
> -Will
> www.partsandcrafts.org
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