[hackerspaces] Firearms in Hackerspaces?

[Matt Joyce]

I enjoy target shooting.  My mother uses a rifle regularly on
woodchucks that create a hazard around her home.

There are at least 2 non-killing human uses of a firearm right there.

Let us not debate the ethics of fire arms.

The question of why to have a fire arm in the space spans many issues.
 As raised before some folks are required to carry a fire arm as part
of their professional life.  That should not by itself immediately
disenfranchise them in a community.

Some folks enjoy fire arms as a hobby.  Either in target shooting, or
in hunting, or conceivably simply as an academic pursuit.  These folks
would find the tools of a hackerspace useful to extend their hobby.
And I suppose that could breed some conflict in a community as
passions run high when discussing this issue.  Each space will know
how to address that themselves.  I love the idea of requiring people
working on fire arms to leave any ammunition at home.  There are also
regional laws to take into consideration.

It is my hope that any discussion on this list remains open and
accepting of the different viewpoints we all have.  Especially on a
topic that can so easily blind us with emotion.

-Matt

On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 3:42 PM, Al Billings <albill at openbuddha.com> wrote:
> Remind me again why I want guns in my hackerspace?
>
> I say this as someone who grew up shooting with hunting family too.
>
> --
> Al Billings
> http://www.openbuddha.com
> http://makehacklearn.org
>
> On Monday, January 14, 2013 at 12:39 PM, Phillip Rhodes wrote:
>
> Because there is, in general, absolutely ZERO reason to think that
> said single-use tool
> would be directed at you, or even used at all. The truth is, at
> least in the US, far less than
> one half of one percent of civilian firearms are ever used in the
> commission of a crime, much
> less a homicide. And while everybody rants about the "gun violence"
> problem, people conveniently
> overlook two facts: 1. mass shootings are statistically rare to the
> point of being nothing more than
> noise in the signal. You're approximately as likely to be killed by a
> lightning strike as to be killed in
> a mass shooting. 2. Of the firearms deaths that *do* happen a
> significant percentage are suicide, or involve
> gang members / drug users killing / robbing each other. So, unless
> you routinely have drug deals going down
> in your space, or you invite the local Crips or Bloods chapter into
> visit, it's absolutely ridiculous to be deathly
> afraid of a firearm carried by a run-of-the-mill, law-abiding citizen.
> Even more so if they have a concealed
> carry permit, because the people who go to the effort to get their CCW
> permits are even less likely to use their
> firearms to commit a crime.
>
>
> Phil
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 3:33 PM, Michel Gallant <sfxman at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I was addressing Pete's equivocation of guns with other tools. A gun is a
> tool for ending lives. Why is it insane to be afraid of having that
> dangerous, single-use tool at a hackerspace?
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 3:30 PM, Phillip Rhodes <motley.crue.fan at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> If that were true, then how could anyone ever use a drill press, band
> saw, lathe, etc.
> I think having a healthy-respect for tools is one thing, but being
> *afraid* of them is quite
> something else. But maybe we're just debating semantics?
>
> At any rate, all tools can be dangerous and deserve to be used with care
> and
> the proper precautions. In that regard, how is a pistol any different
> from a band-saw?
>
>
> Phil
>
> On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 3:24 PM, Michel Gallant <sfxman at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> Being afraid of tools that can rip your fingers off isn't insane, it's
> healthy. You are insane to claim otherwise.
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 2:47 PM, Mark Atwood <me at mark.atwood.name>
> wrote:
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 14, 2013 at 9:16 AM, Pete Prodoehl <raster at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>
> Here's a quick question for US-based hacker/makerspaces... Do you
> have a
> firearms ban at your space, and if so, what are some of the reasons
> behind
> the decision?
>
>
> We don't have a rule at our space. Our space is a member-oriented
> space, no "general public" except as guests of members or as visitors
> to specific private events.
>
> If such a rule was proposed, I would argue strongly against it. If
> someone is a legal owner/carrier of a firearm, if we can't trust them
> with their gun, we can't trust them with all the tools *either*.
>
> More generally, if someone in a makerspace is "afraid" of guns, that's
> insane. They should be afraid of all the other tools too.
>
> ..m
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