[hackerspaces] An interesting point of view : "On Feminism and Microcontrollers"

[Matt Joyce]

Oh and fuck furries too!

On Sat, Oct 2, 2010 at 1:01 PM, Matt Joyce <matt at nycresistor.com> wrote:

> Femenists are as dumb as wife beaters.  Let em rot.  We got hacking to do.
> Either you are on board with that, or you aren't.  I don't care what sex
> organs you have as long as they aren't mine.
>
> Or, for those who want to get flaim baited by me:
>
> Jeez.  We get it, you like hackerspaces.  I am sorry for you that your
> sociology degree is useless in them, much like everywhere else... but you
> need to stop beating that dead horse and get in the fucking game ( or doll
> house if you prefer ).
>
> Don't overheat your little brain cases trying to figure out why girls hate
> math.  Most people hate math.
>
> Don't waste your welfare checks trying to find out if it's a conspiracy
> that there are so many fried chicken joints around your housing project.
> Most people love fried chicken.  It's delicious.  I might eat some today in
> fact.
>
> Gosh...  why did we ever let you people vote.  Go watch your survivor and
> play your wow and wait for use to provide you with the next great placebo to
> treat your depression.  I mean why stop wallowing in your own self pity long
> enough to be awesome when you can instead further bury yourself in your own
> ridiculous self delusion.  You crack baby.
>
> Oh, I voted for Bush...  the second time.
>
> Eat it.
>
> -openfly
> On Oct 2, 2010 12:44 PM, "Chris Weiss" <cweiss at gmail.com> wrote:
> > In St. Louis we have only a few female members, but when they visit on
> > their own accord, they tend to stick around at a much higher rate than
> > male vistors.
> >
> > it doens't sound like you guys are doing anything wrong, you just
> > haven't had the right women come across your space.
> >
> > On Sat, Oct 2, 2010 at 2:30 PM, Sylva1n <sylv41n at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> Are there clear female-barrier-to-entry identified for hackerspaces,
> >> or female no-noes that hackerspaces-in-the-making should be aware of?
> >> Because in Grenoble (France), despite the openness of our
> >> hackerspace-creation process, we have no female-hacker interest. None.
> >> Zilch.
> >> I've recently visited the Toulouse hackerspace, and despite the sole
> >> female hacker being treated exactly like any other member (no sexist
> >> jokes, nor special privileges), the gender imbalance is staggering!
> >>
> >> On Sat, Oct 2, 2010 at 2:35 PM, Maria Droujkova <droujkova at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>  Lack of welcome takes different forms. For example, some books are
> read by
> >>> different genders disproportionally, because of words in them.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Sat, Oct 2, 2010 at 6:27 AM, Yves Quemener <quemener.yves at free.fr>
> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> >
> >>>>
> >>>> Honestly, I am tired of this sexist crap...
> >>>
> >>> Some types of conversations may feel repelling to either gender,
> because men
> >>> and women talk differently. You can see it at mixed parties, when they
> >>> separate. There are general conversation styles, and then there are
> separate
> >>> ones, "girl talk" and "boy talk."
> >>>
> >>> I used to hang out with physics and math Olympiad crowds and then math
> >>> students, mostly male, when I was young. There were a lot of subtle
> examples
> >>> of differences of this sort - discourse, body language, spatial
> behavior,
> >>> intellectual behavior, humor and so on.
> >>>
> >>> Now I organize math groups for kids and for grown-ups. My kid groups
> are
> >>> homeschoolers, who can choose what classes to take, so you can see some
> of
> >>> those free choice behaviors. I can design a class that will
> predominantly
> >>> attract either gender, or a class that attracts both. I can also design
> a
> >>> class that either gender will perceive as unwelcoming. And this will
> have
> >>> very little to do with actual math content. For example, requiring
> writing
> >>> or text chat of 8-12 year olds, especially if you pay any attention to
> style
> >>> and grammar, will powerfully and disproportionately repel boys. Timed
> >>> competitive problem solving will disproportionally repel girls.
> >>>
> >>> There are a lot of observations about these effects in free choice
> >>> situations, hacker spaces included. An example that has a lot of data
> is
> >>> World of Warcraft, where designers went out of their ways to welcome
> both
> >>> genders. This works for older people: there are about the same number
> of men
> >>> and women playing, once the player age is past 30 or so. However,
> female
> >>> youths between 15 and 20 are a tiny minority compared to males that
> age. The
> >>> ratio gradually changes toward 30. There are systemic social factors
> in-game
> >>> that cause this to happen, and these factors are quite complex.
> >>>
> >>>>
> >>>> Sure, there are less girls in hackerspace because it is perceived as a
> >>>> boy's hobby. I personally think that this is wrong and that just shows
> a
> >>>> prejudice existing in the society as a whole. To change that, what we
> need
> >>>> is more female security experts, more female hardware hackers, more
> female
> >>>> robot makers but we don't need to make a new segregation between men's
> >>>> hacks and women's hacks, that would be just admitting defeat.
> >>>
> >>> I fully agree with the first part of it. If women take key positions a
> >>> community, they change the atmosphere. Hackerspaces that have female
> >>> organizers, like our new Durham, NC space, don't seem to have
> segregation
> >>> issues. It may take some segregation for this to happen, initially, if
> an
> >>> established hackerspace is already segregated. For example, to invite
> women,
> >>> you may need to invite several of them at once to form a
> micro-community of
> >>> support within the space. This way, they will feel comfortable even
> before
> >>> the atmosphere changes enough and this segregated support is not needed
> >>> anymore.
> >>>
> >>> Cheers,
> >>> Maria Droujkova
> >>>
> >>> Make math your own, to make your own math.
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Discuss mailing list
> >>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
> >>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> >>>
> >>>
> >>
> >> --
> >> Sylvain
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Discuss mailing list
> >> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
> >> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Discuss mailing list
> > Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
> > http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>
-------------- next part --------------
An HTML attachment was scrubbed...
URL: <http://lists.hackerspaces.org/pipermail/discuss/attachments/20101002/d9da67f7/attachment-0001.htm>