[hackerspaces] An interesting point of view : "On Feminism and Microcontrollers"

Matt Joyce matt at nycresistor.com
Sat Oct 2 22:01:12 CEST 2010

Femenists are as dumb as wife beaters.  Let em rot.  We got hacking to do.
Either you are on board with that, or you aren't.  I don't care what sex
organs you have as long as they aren't mine.

Or, for those who want to get flaim baited by me:

Jeez.  We get it, you like hackerspaces.  I am sorry for you that your
sociology degree is useless in them, much like everywhere else... but you
need to stop beating that dead horse and get in the fucking game ( or doll
house if you prefer ).

Don't overheat your little brain cases trying to figure out why girls hate
math.  Most people hate math.

Don't waste your welfare checks trying to find out if it's a conspiracy that
there are so many fried chicken joints around your housing project.  Most
people love fried chicken.  It's delicious.  I might eat some today in fact.

Gosh...  why did we ever let you people vote.  Go watch your survivor and
play your wow and wait for use to provide you with the next great placebo to
treat your depression.  I mean why stop wallowing in your own self pity long
enough to be awesome when you can instead further bury yourself in your own
ridiculous self delusion.  You crack baby.

Oh, I voted for Bush...  the second time.

Eat it.

On Oct 2, 2010 12:44 PM, "Chris Weiss" <cweiss at gmail.com> wrote:
> In St. Louis we have only a few female members, but when they visit on
> their own accord, they tend to stick around at a much higher rate than
> male vistors.
> it doens't sound like you guys are doing anything wrong, you just
> haven't had the right women come across your space.
> On Sat, Oct 2, 2010 at 2:30 PM, Sylva1n <sylv41n at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Are there clear female-barrier-to-entry identified for hackerspaces,
>> or female no-noes that hackerspaces-in-the-making should be aware of?
>> Because in Grenoble (France), despite the openness of our
>> hackerspace-creation process, we have no female-hacker interest. None.
>> Zilch.
>> I've recently visited the Toulouse hackerspace, and despite the sole
>> female hacker being treated exactly like any other member (no sexist
>> jokes, nor special privileges), the gender imbalance is staggering!
>> On Sat, Oct 2, 2010 at 2:35 PM, Maria Droujkova <droujkova at gmail.com>
>>>  Lack of welcome takes different forms. For example, some books are read
>>> different genders disproportionally, because of words in them.
>>> On Sat, Oct 2, 2010 at 6:27 AM, Yves Quemener <quemener.yves at free.fr>
>>>> >
>>>> Honestly, I am tired of this sexist crap...
>>> Some types of conversations may feel repelling to either gender, because
>>> and women talk differently. You can see it at mixed parties, when they
>>> separate. There are general conversation styles, and then there are
>>> ones, "girl talk" and "boy talk."
>>> I used to hang out with physics and math Olympiad crowds and then math
>>> students, mostly male, when I was young. There were a lot of subtle
>>> of differences of this sort - discourse, body language, spatial
>>> intellectual behavior, humor and so on.
>>> Now I organize math groups for kids and for grown-ups. My kid groups are
>>> homeschoolers, who can choose what classes to take, so you can see some
>>> those free choice behaviors. I can design a class that will
>>> attract either gender, or a class that attracts both. I can also design
>>> class that either gender will perceive as unwelcoming. And this will
>>> very little to do with actual math content. For example, requiring
>>> or text chat of 8-12 year olds, especially if you pay any attention to
>>> and grammar, will powerfully and disproportionately repel boys. Timed
>>> competitive problem solving will disproportionally repel girls.
>>> There are a lot of observations about these effects in free choice
>>> situations, hacker spaces included. An example that has a lot of data is
>>> World of Warcraft, where designers went out of their ways to welcome
>>> genders. This works for older people: there are about the same number of
>>> and women playing, once the player age is past 30 or so. However, female
>>> youths between 15 and 20 are a tiny minority compared to males that age.
>>> ratio gradually changes toward 30. There are systemic social factors
>>> that cause this to happen, and these factors are quite complex.
>>>> Sure, there are less girls in hackerspace because it is perceived as a
>>>> boy's hobby. I personally think that this is wrong and that just shows
>>>> prejudice existing in the society as a whole. To change that, what we
>>>> is more female security experts, more female hardware hackers, more
>>>> robot makers but we don't need to make a new segregation between men's
>>>> hacks and women's hacks, that would be just admitting defeat.
>>> I fully agree with the first part of it. If women take key positions a
>>> community, they change the atmosphere. Hackerspaces that have female
>>> organizers, like our new Durham, NC space, don't seem to have
>>> issues. It may take some segregation for this to happen, initially, if
>>> established hackerspace is already segregated. For example, to invite
>>> you may need to invite several of them at once to form a micro-community
>>> support within the space. This way, they will feel comfortable even
>>> the atmosphere changes enough and this segregated support is not needed
>>> anymore.
>>> Cheers,
>>> Maria Droujkova
>>> Make math your own, to make your own math.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Discuss mailing list
>>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
>>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
>> --
>> Sylvain
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