[hackerspaces] Working on setting up my space

Thu Oct 22 19:08:53 CEST 2009

We're not done with ours yet, but we've got it posted in draft form on our wiki:

http://wiki.hive13.org/index.php?title=Form_1023_Draft

Actually, I would also be *very* interested in feedback from any other
hackerspaces that have already completed this process before I finally
send our forms in.

Thanks!

~Dave

On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 1:04 PM, Tim Krabec <tkrabec at gmail.com> wrote:
> I think we want a 501c3, but my accountant thinks it may fit another c
> better.  I'm just looking for the supporting Docs to show my account how
> other people have done it, I don't think she understands.
>
> Also I think hackerspaces are defined by their local community as to what
> they are or are not, and that can change overtime.
>
> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 12:58 PM, Adam D Bachman <adam.bachman at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>>
>> I stand corrected. It was not my intention to forcefully modify your
>> meaning. I should've said, "what I'm hearing is, ...". I was seeking
>> clarification on what seemed like a strict interpretation of Hackerspace
>> doctrine (which we're both aware doesn't actually exist).
>> > Tom hasn't stated what he's doing yet. So please no snap judgements
>> That was my point, too. I think we're on the same page.
>> > he will have problems getting certain types of funding if his focus is
>> > on education
>> I (and to my knowledge, B'more Node) haven't pursued direct funding from
>> charitable organizations, so I don't have experience in this area. Do you
>> mean that if he has a focus on education and *is* a 501c3 he will have
>> problems, or has a focus on education and *is not* a 501c3 he will have
>> problems?
>> > if people are respectful of each other and improve the community around
>> > them through collaboration of these things that they are a hackerspace or
>> > not
>> Yes. This is pretty simply what I believe "hackerspace" to mean. Our
>> bylaws say, "Baltimore Node Corporation seeks to create and sustain an
>> environment that promotes the creative use of technology for the benefit of
>> art, science and culture." and we go about that by (paraphrased)
>> "establishing and maintaining a physical space, supporting a nurturing
>> community of makers devoted to education and collaboration, empowering
>> members to create, experiment and invent; encouraging and supporting the
>> sharing of research; and actively engaging with the community." -
>> http://wiki.baltimorenode.org/index.php?title=Bylaws
>> My point was that IRS considerations (especially since they're strictly
>> USA centered) don't have anything to do with what is or isn't a hackerspace.
>> My apologies, again, for jumping before you said "boo".
>>
>> - Adam
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 12:45 PM, Eric Michaud <michaud.eric.c at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> This also only applies to US tax law, I can't comment on other countries.
>>>
>>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 11:43 AM, Eric Michaud <michaud.eric.c at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I didn't say he wouldn't be one of them because of those, but it's hard
>>>> to show the shades of we're doing this because of X. There are many flavors,
>>>> but the main thing is what are you focusing on. Are you aiming to be a Tech
>>>> Shop? or something else? What also becomes difficult is if we want to share
>>>> assets with another group. It's not as trivial to do so. As PSOne is filing
>>>> ours shortly we found out a lot of other groups not including grant writers
>>>> don't want to donate equipment or services to other groups because they
>>>> either A don't know how to handle it, or B the appearance to others as to
>>>> who they donated for is not a straight up traditional thought of
>>>> Not-For-Profit 501c3.
>>>>
>>>> Also Adam please don't paraphrase what I said. That is incorrect.
>>>>
>>>> I stated.
>>>>
>>>> " If that is not the case your not really being a hackerspace since the
>>>> main focus is on educating the many and sharing tools."
>>>>
>>>> Three things
>>>>
>>>> Tom may have a very excellent reason for what he's doing.  Tom hasn't
>>>> stated what he's doing yet. So please no snap judgements.
>>>>
>>>> The next thing is I said what I said because there are a lot of place
>>>> calling themselves hackerspaces when they are clearly not.  I wanted to make
>>>> sure he knows that he will have problems getting certain types of funding if
>>>> his focus is on education. Regardless of what form his group takes.
>>>>
>>>> The third point is being a hackerspace is about sharing
>>>> knowledge(education) and resources(tools or otherwise) with the community on
>>>> a very basic level. Do you not agree with this that if people are respectful
>>>> of each other and improve the community around them through collaboration of
>>>> these things that they are a hackerspace or not?
>>>>
>>>> Adam I agree with you that you don't have to be a 501c3 to be a
>>>> hackerspace, I don't know where your getting that idea from. Please don't
>>>> misinterpret what I'm stating is all.
>>>>
>>>> I wanted to get it out that I'm not telling everyone what one is or
>>>> isn't but that Tom might have problems arising later in collaborating with
>>>> certain groups. It's like the GPLv2 and GPLv3. How many issues came up with
>>>> licensing alone when GPLv3 came online as a tool for software licensing.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Cheers,
>>>>
>>>> -Eric.
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 11:25 AM, Adam D Bachman
>>>> <adam.bachman at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> >  If that is not the case your not really being a hackerspace since
>>>>> > the main focus is on educating the many and sharing tools.
>>>>> That sounds like a false dichotomy. "Be a 501c3 and pursue MacArthur
>>>>> grants" (be one of us?) or "you're not a hackerspace".
>>>>> While I agree that going down another of the 501 roads might be a waste
>>>>> of time, I wouldn't suggest they're traitors to the cause.
>>>>> We at Baltimore Node haven't pursued 501c3 status because of the
>>>>> expense and because there's no immediate need for the status*. We're
>>>>> definitely still a hackerspace, though.
>>>>>
>>>>> - Adam Bachman
>>>>> http://baltimorenode.org
>>>>> * - I should note that I'm indifferent to our tax exempt status since
>>>>> my contributions aren't enough to justify itemizing on my tax returns, so
>>>>> I'm not going to pursue it. When someone sees the need clearly and is
>>>>> willing to act on it, though, it will get done.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 12:02 PM, Eric Michaud
>>>>> <michaud.eric.c at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sorry, I meant to state  before I accidentally clicked send. Why are
>>>>>> you not doing 501c3? Since c6 is for Recreational groups., and c7 is focused
>>>>>> on groups for lobbying.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You wouldn't be able to get grants as easily at all. if your looking
>>>>>> for stuff from MacArthur, NSF, or a number of other educational groups. If
>>>>>> that is not the case your not really being a hackerspace since the main
>>>>>> focus is on educating the many and sharing tools.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Also which state are you in?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'd also love to talk shop with you about this if you'd like.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 10:58 AM, Eric Michaud
>>>>>> <michaud.eric.c at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hey Tim, why are your leanings to the other groups instead of just
>>>>>>> 501c3? or c7? Are you planning to not be community oriented or lobby
>>>>>>> congress?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Oct 22, 2009 at 10:19 AM, Tim Krabec <tkrabec at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Id like to get a copy of some one's IRS Form1023, my accountant is
>>>>>>>> leaning towards a 501c6 or c7 vs the c3.  I'd like to get more info to her.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Tim
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>> Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>
>>>
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>
>
>
> --
> Tim Krabec
> Kracomp
> 772-597-2349
> smbminute.com
> kracomp.blogspot.com
> www.kracomp.com
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