[sudoroom] Ferro Fluids Sudo Project group
Tracy Jacobs
kinetical at comcast.net
Thu Jul 19 02:28:53 CEST 2012
Ebay does seem to have the best price 15.00 + 12.00 shipping. I can
get it. I'll let you know when it arrives. So, not tonight, it's
better to wait for that. I'll order it now.
Tracy
On Jul 18, 2012, at 5:25 PM, Patrik D'haeseleer wrote:
> You would still need some oleic acid for the FeCl recipe as well,
> right? That seems to be our main bottleneck right now...
>
> I could swing by Sudoroom this evening, but I'm still in Livermore
> right now. And if we don't have any oleic acid it'd be rather
> pointless...
>
> Patrik
>
> On Wed, Jul 18, 2012 at 5:19 PM, Tracy Jacobs
> <kinetical at comcast.net> wrote:
> Hey Patrick,
>
> Are you ready to do some ferro fluid stuff this evening? If so, we
> should meet before dark and work outside probably. Matt told me
> there is an alley behind the building we could probably mix up
> messy toxic stuff in. I am going to try my recipe with the ferric
> chloride probably this weekend at home in my yard. It just seems
> like I need to set up a controlled environment outside to do that.
> But if anybody wants to come help me they can! I'll come by Sudo
> room tonight if you are ready to start on your recipe? Let me know.
>
> Tracy
>
> On Jul 18, 2012, at 12:12 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer wrote:
>
>> Yeah, very nice one. It kinda looks like they just used one of
>> those conical step drill bits (aka unibit) with an electromagnet
>> underneath. The shape of steel drill bit bends the magnetic field
>> lines, so the magnetic field is actually a bit stronger on the
>> sharp edges of the drill bit. And as you crank up the
>> electromagnet, the ferrofluid gets pulled up to those areas with
>> the highest field strength.
>>
>> I can kinda understand why it's doing what it's doing, but being
>> able to predict how it's going to behave is a whole different
>> matter...
>>
>> Patrik
>>
>> PS: if you want to see some entirely incomprehensible behavior, we
>> should try mixing some ferrofluid with oobleck (corn starch + water
>> non-Newtonian fluid) on a vibrating plate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yp1wUodQgqQ
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 11:18 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate at gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>> Wow, I knew I'd seen something like that before, friend of friends'
>> music video:
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zemkodUsPEw
>>
>> // Matt
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 10:59 PM, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd at gmail.com
>> > wrote:
>> I've seen that FeCl3 based recipe in a few other places. This may
>> be the original source: http://www.sci-spot.com/Chemistry/liqimag.htm
>>
>> You definitely don't need all the fancy lab equipment, just some
>> measuring cups and an old pot to boil the stuff in. You do need to
>> boil off a lot of ammonia - probably not something you'd want to do
>> indoors.
>>
>> Electromagnets are everywhere - any electrical motor has
>> electromagnets inside, and you can always wind one yourself with
>> some copper wire around an iron core, like a nail. I've got some
>> small DC motors in the Sudoroom locker at TechLiminal that we can
>> scavenge for small magnets and electromagnets.
>>
>> Patrik
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 9:57 PM, Tracy Jacobs
>> <kinetical at comcast.net> wrote:
>> http://www.gdiy.com/projects/liquid-magnets-ferrofluid/index.php
>>
>> This looks like a good recipe. It uses steel wool for the metal.
>> I do have some Ferric Chloride from etching pcbs in my garage. I
>> can get kerosene and ammonia, and you found a source for Oleic
>> Acid. It doesn't sound like we would need very much 10ml.
>>
>> Do you have some of the lab equipment it calls for?
>>
>> Are you working from a recipe? Do you want to try both?
>>
>> I have a dogwalking business and a full schedule tomorrow., so I
>> don't know that I'll be ready by tomorrow. I won't have a chance to
>> run to Berkeley and get Oleic acid anyway. Maybe Friday or the
>> weekend would be better. I think I have a couple old hard drives
>> if I can find them in this mess. They are supposed to have good
>> magnets.
>>
>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUz1ZI-w6LQ&feature=BFa&list=PLD113CD853249B687
>>
>> How could they do this do you think? All the movement is
>> interesting to be sure. They are talking about using fluxes too,
>> but it is not clear to me. Do you know what they are talking
>> about? It almost looks like they pump the fluid up from the center.
>>
>> Do you have a link for the electromagnets you are talking about or
>> did you make them? I can't wait to try this!
>>
>> Thanks for your help. Let's talk tomorrow, I don't get home till
>> about 5.
>>
>> Tracy
>>
>> On Jul 17, 2012, at 1:38 PM, Patrik D'haeseleer wrote:
>>
>>> I was thinking that some non-magnetic material would make it
>>> easier to manipulate the overall magnetic field using some low-
>>> powered electromagnets. Hence Alu foil instead of cast iron.
>>>
>>> Actually, we could just start from a cheap plastic skull ($17.27
>>> on Amazon, or dig through your Halloween closet), and implant some
>>> magnets to get the ferrofluid to stick.
>>>
>>> Patrik
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 9:24 AM, Tracy Jacobs
>>> <kinetical at comcast.net> wrote:
>>> Patrick,
>>>
>>> I love your idea ! Cast iron would be better than foil to be
>>> sure. Maybe greenman would be a fitting subject.
>>>
>>> I'm ok with Wed or Fri, maybe Friday if I have to run around and
>>> get supplies too.
>>>
>>> Tracy
>>>
>>> On Jul 17, 2012, at 1:12 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer wrote:
>>>
>>>> I could do Wednesday or Friday - prefer Wednesday. I can bring my
>>>> small sample of cemmercial ferrofluid for comparison with the DIY
>>>> versions.
>>>>
>>>> Does anyone have access to oleic acid to use as a surfactant?
>>>> That should keep the ferrite particles from clumping together,
>>>> and make for a much smoother ferrofluid. Supposed to be around 5%
>>>> magnetite (3-15% by volume), 10% surfactant (6-30%), and 85% oil
>>>> (55-91%).
>>>>
>>>> Someone on Instructables mentioned you can also get ferrite at a
>>>> pottery supply store for $2-$5 a pound. Know anyone into pottery?
>>>> Anyone want to check out Leslie Ceramic Supply, 1212 San Pablo in
>>>> Berkeley, just North of Gilman?
>>>>
>>>> In terms of art pieces, I think it would be really cool to do an
>>>> animated sculpture covered in ferrofluid, with electromagnets
>>>> hidden inside so you can change the texture of the ferrofluid.
>>>> The simplest version could just be a face molded out of aluminum
>>>> foil, with small magnets embedded to get the ferrofluid to cover
>>>> the surface. Then put some electromagnets behind the face, so you
>>>> can change its expression by manipulating the ferrofluid.
>>>>
>>>> Patrik
>>>>
>>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 10:11 PM, Tracy Jacobs <kinetical at comcast.net
>>>> > wrote:
>>>> Hi All,
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for expressing interest in doing a Ferrofluid experiment
>>>> together. I'd love to make our project the centerpiece of our
>>>> Art Murmur show. Art Murmur is in two weeks. I asked Jake to
>>>> share his experiment during Art Murmur. He made his in like a
>>>> day, and it turned out really well. He mixed MICR with cooking
>>>> oil and put it between two slides with a magnetized paper clip.
>>>> That was projected on a wall for a really interesting painterly
>>>> effect. Very small scale and inexpensive, too.
>>>>
>>>> So, we need Ferrofluid. I know Patrick ordered some iron oxide,
>>>> and he has sent us some good links. There are different methods
>>>> we can try for making the fluid ourselves, because it can be
>>>> expensive to buy. I want to try a couple different recipes.
>>>> Patrick can you get back to me with your reccomendations for what
>>>> we should try and what we still need to buy for that?
>>>>
>>>> I am interested in magnetizing a couple of iron sculptures that I
>>>> made a long time ago. From what I understand this involves
>>>> wrapping them in coated copper wire and charging them. If you
>>>> find any interesting steel or iron objects, these would be good
>>>> to play with.
>>>>
>>>> We also need magnets. Powerful magnets can be taken from old
>>>> hard drives, so if you have any old hard drives bring them. I
>>>> will bring tools. Or if you have any magnets, bring those.
>>>>
>>>> We should meet up soon. Could you let me know your
>>>> availability? I have Weds night, Fri night, or the weekend
>>>> anytime.
>>>>
>>>> Tracy
>>>>
>>>> www.funkyautomata.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Jul 16, 2012, at 12:36 PM, Jehan Tremback wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Wow, imagine making a batch with a 44 lb bag, using a gigantic
>>>>> electromagnet, and creating the hugest ferrofluid sculpture
>>>>> known to man. Might be messy if the power cut out though.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Jehan
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 9:12 AM, Anca | Tech Liminal <anca at techliminal.com
>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>> The rust lady said she got all her supplies at Michael's - but
>>>>> that they weren't well-labeled. Look in the patina isle (yes,
>>>>> there is a patina isle!)
>>>>>
>>>>> Anca.
>>>>>
>>>>> -=-=-=-=-
>>>>> Anca Mosoiu | Tech Liminal
>>>>> anca at techliminal.com
>>>>> M: (510) 220-6660
>>>>> W: http://techliminal.com | T: @techliminal | F: facebook.com/
>>>>> techliminal
>>>>>
>>>>> On Jul 12, 2012, at 6:14 PM, Patrik D'haeseleer wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> I got some ferrofluid from Inventables a while back - wasn't
>>>>>> too expensive: $13.60 for a fluid ounce. Haven't tried mixing
>>>>>> it with any water colors yet though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> https://www.inventables.com/technologies/magnetic-fluid
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I also noticed that the person teaching the "Create Real Rust"
>>>>>> class at Workshop Weekend had a jar of atomized iron powder
>>>>>> that I was thinking would probably work fairly well to make
>>>>>> ferrofluid. May be worth checking some art stores with a magnet
>>>>>> - or just ask that teacher where she got hers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think the Exploratorium or another similar booth had a nice
>>>>>> ferrofluid demo at Maker Faire one or two years ago. Just a big
>>>>>> glob of ferrofluid in a glass jar, and some powerful magnets
>>>>>> that people could move by turning a wheel.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Patrik
>>>>>>
>>>>>> PS: Doesn't quite classify as a ferro"fluid", but check out the
>>>>>> video about this guy's work:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> http://jolanvanderwiel.nl/?p=272
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Thu, Jul 12, 2012 at 5:32 PM, Tracy Jacobs <kinetical at comcast.net
>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>> http://www.thecreatorsproject.com/blog/ferrofluids-go-next-level-technicolor-in-fabian-oefners-amazing-images
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Begin forwarded message:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> From: Tracy Jacobs <kinetical at comcast.net>
>>>>>>> Date: July 12, 2012 5:29:10 PM PDT
>>>>>>> To: SUDOroom list <sudoroom at lists.hackerspaces.org>
>>>>>>> Subject: [sudoroom] Ferro Fluids?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I was wondering if anyone would be interested in doing some
>>>>>>> experimentation with Ferro fluids as a group project? If we
>>>>>>> get nice results we could put them in the box office next Art
>>>>>>> Murmur. I've been wanting to try that for a long time, and
>>>>>>> there are some methods that are free or under ten dollars cheap.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://www.instructables.com/id/Make-your-own-ferrofluid-in-5-minutes/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> A nicer example:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#!/photo.php?
>>>>>>> fbid=503571739658618&set=a.
>>>>>>> 133255743356888.23929.115384328477363&type=1&theater
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tracy
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> sudoroom mailing list
>>>>>>> sudoroom at lists.hackerspaces.org
>>>>>>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/sudoroom
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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