[sudoroom] Ferro Fluids Sudo Project group

Thu Jul 19 02:15:22 CEST 2012

So, shall we do a little DIY ferrofluid-a-thon this Friday at Sudoroom
then?

According to the usps tracking page, I should have a pound of magnetite
waiting for me at home by now.

I still haven't been able to track down any oleic acid, by the way. If you
know a source - please pipe up! The Juniper Tree store in Berkeley doesn't
seem to carry it. I can probably get some on EBay with overnight delivery
to get it by Friday, but that gets expensive...

Patrik

On Wed, Jul 18, 2012 at 12:12 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd at gmail.com>wrote:

> Yeah, very nice one. It kinda looks like they just used one of those
> conical step drill bits (aka unibit) with an electromagnet underneath. The
> shape of steel drill bit bends the magnetic field lines, so the magnetic
> field is actually a bit stronger on the sharp edges of the drill bit. And
> as you crank up the electromagnet, the ferrofluid gets pulled up to those
> areas with the highest field strength.
>
> I can kinda understand why it's doing what it's doing, but being able to
> predict how it's going to behave is a whole different matter...
>
> Patrik
>
> PS: if you want to see some entirely incomprehensible behavior, we should
> try mixing some ferrofluid with oobleck (corn starch + water non-Newtonian
> fluid) on a vibrating plate: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Yp1wUodQgqQ
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 11:18 PM, Matthew Senate <mattsenate at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Wow, I knew I'd seen something like that before, friend of friends' music
>> video:
>>
>> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zemkodUsPEw
>>
>> // Matt
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 10:59 PM, Patrik D'haeseleer <patrikd at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> I've seen that FeCl3 based recipe in a few other places. This may be the
>>> original source: http://www.sci-spot.com/Chemistry/liqimag.htm
>>>
>>> You definitely don't need all the fancy lab equipment, just some
>>> measuring cups and an old pot to boil the stuff in. You do need to boil off
>>> a lot of ammonia - probably not something you'd want to do indoors.
>>>
>>> Electromagnets are everywhere - any electrical motor has electromagnets
>>> inside, and you can always wind one yourself with some copper wire around
>>> an iron core, like a nail. I've got some small DC motors in the Sudoroom
>>> locker at TechLiminal that we can scavenge for small magnets and
>>> electromagnets.
>>>
>>> Patrik
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 9:57 PM, Tracy Jacobs <kinetical at comcast.net>wrote:
>>>
>>>> http://www.gdiy.com/projects/liquid-magnets-ferrofluid/index.php
>>>>
>>>> This looks like a good recipe.  It uses steel wool for the metal.  I do
>>>> have some Ferric Chloride from etching pcbs in my garage.  I can get
>>>> kerosene and ammonia, and you found a source for Oleic Acid.  It doesn't
>>>> sound like we would need very much 10ml.
>>>>
>>>> Do you have some of the lab equipment it calls for?
>>>>
>>>> Are you working from a  recipe?  Do you want to try both?
>>>>
>>>> I have a dogwalking business and a full schedule tomorrow., so I don't
>>>> know that I'll be ready by tomorrow. I won't have a chance to run to
>>>> Berkeley and get Oleic acid anyway.  Maybe Friday or the weekend would be
>>>> better.   I think I have a couple old hard drives if I can find them in
>>>> this mess.  They are supposed to have good magnets.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XUz1ZI-w6LQ&feature=BFa&list=PLD113CD853249B687
>>>>
>>>> How could they do this do you think?  All the movement is interesting
>>>> to be sure. They are talking about using fluxes too, but it is not clear to
>>>> me.  Do you know what they are talking about?  It almost looks like they
>>>> pump the fluid up from the center.
>>>>
>>>>  Do you have a link for the electromagnets you are talking about or did
>>>> you make them?  I can't wait to try this!
>>>>
>>>> Thanks for your help.  Let's talk tomorrow, I don't get home till about
>>>> 5.
>>>>
>>>> Tracy
>>>>
>>>> On Jul 17, 2012, at 1:38 PM, Patrik D'haeseleer wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I was thinking that some non-magnetic material would make it easier to
>>>> manipulate the overall magnetic field using some low-powered
>>>> electromagnets. Hence Alu foil instead of cast iron.
>>>>
>>>> Actually, we could just start from a cheap plastic skull ($17.27 on
>>>> Amazon<http://www.amazon.com/Anatomical-Chart-Company-CS20-Life-Size/dp/B000VKSDYE>,
>>>> or dig through your Halloween closet), and implant some magnets to get the
>>>> ferrofluid to stick.
>>>>
>>>> Patrik
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Jul 17, 2012 at 9:24 AM, Tracy Jacobs <kinetical at comcast.net>wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Patrick,
>>>>>
>>>>> I love your idea !  Cast iron would be better than foil to be sure.
>>>>>  Maybe greenman would be a fitting subject.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm ok with Wed or Fri, maybe Friday if I have to run around and get
>>>>> supplies too.
>>>>>
>>>>> Tracy
>>>>>
>>>>> On Jul 17, 2012, at 1:12 AM, Patrik D'haeseleer wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I could do Wednesday or Friday - prefer Wednesday. I can bring my
>>>>> small sample of cemmercial ferrofluid for comparison with the DIY versions.
>>>>>
>>>>> Does anyone have access to oleic acid to use as a surfactant? That
>>>>> should keep the ferrite particles from clumping together, and make for a
>>>>> much smoother ferrofluid. Supposed to be around 5% magnetite (3-15% by
>>>>> volume), 10% surfactant (6-30%), and 85% oil (55-91%).
>>>>>
>>>>> Someone on Instructables mentioned you can also get ferrite at a
>>>>> pottery supply store for $2-$5 a pound. Know anyone into pottery? Anyone
>>>>> want to check out Leslie Ceramic Supply, 1212 San Pablo in Berkeley, just
>>>>> North of Gilman?
>>>>>
>>>>> In terms of art pieces, I think it would be really cool to do an
>>>>> animated sculpture covered in ferrofluid, with electromagnets hidden inside
>>>>> so you can change the texture of the ferrofluid. The simplest version could
>>>>> just be a face molded out of aluminum foil, with small magnets embedded to
>>>>> get the ferrofluid to cover the surface. Then put some electromagnets
>>>>> behind the face, so you can change its expression by manipulating the
>>>>> ferrofluid.
>>>>>
>>>>> Patrik
>>>>>
>>>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 10:11 PM, Tracy Jacobs <kinetical at comcast.net>wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi All,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Thanks for expressing interest in doing a Ferrofluid experiment
>>>>>> together.  I'd love to make our project the centerpiece of our Art Murmur
>>>>>> show.  Art Murmur is in two weeks.  I asked Jake to share his experiment
>>>>>> during Art Murmur.  He made his in like a day, and it turned out really
>>>>>> well.  He mixed MICR with cooking oil and put it between two slides with a
>>>>>> magnetized paper clip.  That was projected on a wall for a really
>>>>>> interesting painterly effect.  Very small scale and inexpensive, too.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> So, we need Ferrofluid.   I know Patrick ordered some iron oxide, and
>>>>>> he has sent us some good links.  There are different methods we can try for
>>>>>> making the fluid ourselves, because it can be expensive to buy.  I want to
>>>>>> try a couple different recipes.  Patrick can you get back to me with your
>>>>>> reccomendations for what we should try and what we still need to buy for
>>>>>> that?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am interested in magnetizing a couple of iron sculptures that I
>>>>>> made a long time ago.  From what I understand this involves wrapping them
>>>>>> in coated copper wire and charging them.  If you find any interesting steel
>>>>>> or iron objects, these would be good to play with.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We also need magnets.  Powerful magnets can be taken from old hard
>>>>>> drives, so if you have any old hard drives bring them.  I will bring tools.
>>>>>> Or if you have any magnets, bring those.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We should meet up soon.  Could you let me know your availability?   I
>>>>>> have Weds night, Fri night, or the weekend anytime.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Tracy
>>>>>>
>>>>>> www.funkyautomata.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 16, 2012, at 12:36 PM, Jehan Tremback wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Wow, imagine making a batch with a 44 lb bag, using a gigantic
>>>>>> electromagnet, and creating the hugest ferrofluid sculpture known to man.
>>>>>> Might be messy if the power cut out though.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -Jehan
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Mon, Jul 16, 2012 at 9:12 AM, Anca | Tech Liminal <
>>>>>> anca at techliminal.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The rust lady said she got all her supplies at Michael's - but that
>>>>>>> they weren't well-labeled.  Look in the patina isle (yes, there is a patina
>>>>>>> isle!)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Anca.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>  -=-=-=-=-
>>>>>>> *Anca Mosoiu  | Tech Liminal*
>>>>>>> anca at techliminal.com
>>>>>>> M: (510) 220-6660
>>>>>>> W: http://techliminal.com  | T: @techliminal | F:
>>>>>>> facebook.com/techliminal
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Jul 12, 2012, at 6:14 PM, Patrik D'haeseleer wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I got some ferrofluid from Inventables a while back - wasn't too
>>>>>>> expensive: $13.60 for a fluid ounce. Haven't tried mixing it with any water
>>>>>>> colors yet though.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.inventables.com/technologies/magnetic-fluid
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I also noticed that the person teaching the "Create Real Rust" class
>>>>>>> at Workshop Weekend had a jar of atomized iron powder that I was thinking
>>>>>>> would probably work fairly well to make ferrofluid. May be worth checking
>>>>>>> some art stores with a magnet - or just ask that teacher where she got hers.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I think the Exploratorium or another similar booth had a nice
>>>>>>> ferrofluid demo at Maker Faire one or two years ago. Just a big glob of
>>>>>>> ferrofluid in a glass jar, and some powerful magnets that people could move
>>>>>>> by turning a wheel.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Patrik
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> PS: Doesn't quite classify as a ferro"fluid", but check out the
>>>>>>> video about this guy's work:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://jolanvanderwiel.nl/?p=272
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Thu, Jul 12, 2012 at 5:32 PM, Tracy Jacobs <kinetical at comcast.net
>>>>>>> > wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.thecreatorsproject.com/blog/ferrofluids-go-next-level-technicolor-in-fabian-oefners-amazing-images
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Begin forwarded message:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> *From: *Tracy Jacobs <kinetical at comcast.net>
>>>>>>>> *Date: *July 12, 2012 5:29:10 PM PDT
>>>>>>>> *To: *SUDOroom list <sudoroom at lists.hackerspaces.org>
>>>>>>>> *Subject: **[sudoroom] Ferro Fluids?*
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I was wondering if anyone would be interested in doing some
>>>>>>>> experimentation with Ferro fluids as a group project?  If we get nice
>>>>>>>> results we could put them in the box office next Art Murmur.  I've been
>>>>>>>> wanting to try that for a long time, and there are some methods that are
>>>>>>>> free or under ten dollars cheap.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> http://www.instructables.com/id/Make-your-own-ferrofluid-in-5-minutes/
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> A nicer example:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> https://www.facebook.com/home.php?ref=home#!/photo.php?fbid=503571739658618&set=a.133255743356888.23929.115384328477363&type=1&theater
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Tracy
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> sudoroom mailing list
>>>>>>>> sudoroom at lists.hackerspaces.org
>>>>>>>> http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/sudoroom
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>
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