[foodhackingbase] future possibilities and directions for food hacking base
Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck
algoldor at foodhackingbase.org
Sun Mar 1 12:48:00 CET 2015
Hi to all,
apologies for the delay, comments in the text as ###
On 2015-02-22 16:54, Kai Du wrote:
> Hi Frantisek and all,
>
> thank you and/or sorry for having this discussion started.
### happy to have the discussion at least, at least on my side
Fact is,
> that I am really excited being involved with the FHB for several
> reasons: First is, I am trying to come to the chaos communication camp
> in summer. My first C3-event. I really look forward to meet some of
> you FHB folks and some podcast community members.
### CCC camp should be a great gate how to "enter in person" the
international hacker community.
> I cook for almost all my life and invent recipes for quite a while
> now. If there was a chance to get a financial model to work for paid
> members of the FHB I would be interested, too. My job situation
> changes rapidly in summer and I always dreamt of working with food for
> money. Though I am aware of the fact, that nobody (except alex) met me
> before of the existing crew and maybe a lot of core members would be
> interested in a job too.
### Most of the people involved at fhb are professionals in other fields
and taking food&drink activities more as an hobby and I think in general
they are happy to keep it like that. I think "job" from a traditional
point of view is not what we will end up at the end of the day (if we
end up with something :-)), but we will see. If you want to do stuff
around food as your main activity, than you should give it at least good
try otherwise you would probably regret that you did not.
> I´ve got a lot of interesting projects in
> stasis because of job/money reasons. Talking about projects: I
> recently created a book about lifehacks and I am planning a sequel
> about food hacks. I am interested in any kind of definition or
> suggestion you guys could make. Feel free to contact me via this list
> or directly (kai at hobbykoch-podcast dot de) I am looking for the
> funny kind of food hack, the one-picture-short-explanation-wow ones. I
> see the food hacking community here is more based on technological
> inventions and/or fermentation projects (which is fascinating, too),
> but hey.
### If you have Facebook presence check the Food Hacking Base group
there, people tent to share quite few funny or interesting hack there,
however most of the time we borrow not create. That should change and we
could think about something for your publication. Lets keep it in mind
and maybe you could poke the list about that in week or two. Do you have
some examples for your book already? We could put few nice funny ones on
our wiki.
> Returning to Frantiseks question about finance I think the
> crowdfunding idea is really nice. I read, there was a successfull
> funding of the recent C3-activities. So there is a proof of concept
> this could work.
### The crowdsroucing funding is one of the ways how to get resources,
attention and followers. Our campaigns generally succeed, but we need to
rethink them, shape them better and be much better in running/promoting
when they are opened. Till this day I think that our first one for
OHM2013 was the best managed - of course many thanks for help with the
other ones to everyone who got into it, however that is my feel.
> I guess, there is something that needs to be offered
> in return to make the quite larger budget for paying people a loan
> realistic. I wondered, if a audio/video podcast about food hacking
> could be a decent teaser for a successfull project. I would apply for
> head of production, coordinating recordings and editing of audio/video
> stuff around the world. I´ve got some experiance in that. This could
> be the step from few events on C3 meetings to a larger scale and
> promotion for a larger community, too.
### I think that good audio/video podcast would be very good achievement
from variety of reasons. I would suggest to talk about this separately
and consider doing something smaller, shorter already before CCC camp,
we have plenty of things to catch up. For me for example series about
fermentations would be lovely.
> Excuse me, I may be completely wrong suggesting this. This community
> may stay a forum, in which ideas are exchanged and financial aspects
> are secondary. I would love to do a lot of food hacking, this way or
> other. Please share your thoughts.
### Thanks for the tips, I'll react on the other emails soon. I
personally consider financial aspects secondary, however maybe it is
time to rethink it a bit :-)
> Greetings,
> Kai
### As a summary, lets poke the list about some nice food hack for you
publication and if you have something we could use it for the our fhb
wiki, concerning the podcast we should talk about that as a separate
topic, I'm definitely interested on my side to do something as an
experiment already before CCC camp.
### Talk to you soon,
### Frantisek
>
> Am 22.02.2015 um 04:52 schrieb Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck:
>> Hi to all and Kai,
>> this email became quite long and it is as I write it, no special
>> wordings etc. touching many important topics. If you have been
>> involved for a while or you are just keeping an eye on us, please read
>> it and comment, it would be highly appreciated. Sorry for writing in
>> length.
>>
>> Concerning the fhb financial budget we just kept a track of the budget
>> which we used mostly for the events - preparations, running and
>> closing up. However in the last year or two we started to pay for our
>> hosting service at Uberspace, security certificates (money were
>> donated) and we started to invest more into projects in between the
>> events like the Experimental Incubator development. So in other words
>> things are going in the direction of more permanently active community
>> which produces and consumes more resources and needs more energy and
>> time to keep organized and funded.
>>
>> Joining until know meant that someone is interested in food&drink
>> related projects which have often also scientific and technological
>> aspect, so people started to ask questions, post, got involved with
>> preparations for the congresses and well become fhb base folk :-) No
>> clear procedure, we know each other over the time. Generally people
>> who are around for some time are the "main orga" for the next event if
>> they have time and they want to do it, new people are helping for
>> their first event and if all goes well they get deeper involved in the
>> community later on becoming the orga for next event, starting to
>> exercise the consensus more etc.
>>
>> It seems to me that we are approaching a crossroad where we should
>> decide how to move further. More and more people know about us, more
>> and more people keep in touch. We can do a lot, resources are needed
>> for that, mostly the human ones but financial too. At the moment I can
>> imagine keeping the group smaller and operate as we do now, basically
>> as hobbyist having fun and keeping it easy. Second way would be become
>> more and more active, basically starting to do at least some of our
>> projects as professionals, more on that later. On the topic of
>> membership, having some kind of "membership", associate membership
>> etc. is one of the ways. If we go that road I would suggest not to
>> directly relate it to the "membership payments", having sliding scale
>> options etc. but that is just mine opinion and honestly I'm not sure,
>> I have to think about that and we need to discuss that it is a big
>> thing, however I think we should go through that and decide on
>> something.
>>
>> What I know for myself and can express freely and happily is, that I
>> want to see fhb increasing it's activity which however means also more
>> time and energy invested by people who are involved in it. Till now
>> all these activities which moved us forward were done on voluntary
>> bases, which was lovely however also it becomes clear to me that it is
>> limiting us in a way. We tried to give people who did the work variety
>> of advantages like ingredients from events, wooden materials left
>> afterwards, do some social event in their local community (reciprocal
>> help :-)) etc. but except my case who profited most I would say it was
>> rather symbolic. I personally would be very happy to be able to get
>> some monetary resources from fhb activities because I could invest
>> more time in the project but I'm aware or rather worried how that
>> would affect the dynamic of the group and it's inter human
>> relationship. It seems to me that the effect would be overall negative
>> at least that is my feeling about that. On the other hand I think I
>> can clearly see that several of our activities have really big
>> potential to really be an inspiration and helping a new revolutionary
>> things to happen however without resources for the people who have the
>> knowledge and experience so they can dedicate more time into this
>> directly and make it happen I don't see this likely to happen. That is
>> what I experience on my side when I really would like to dedicate more
>> of my time and energy to these activities but I just cant because I
>> have to go on the field doing some field work for cash to cover my
>> living costs. I feel personally that I can do so much more in food
>> hacking base if I had more time and more stability but it would have
>> to become full time dedication on my side and I do not have personal
>> funds at the moment to make that happen. I have met several people who
>> I know would love to get involved much more but they would need some
>> payment for their work or other types of reimbursements.
>>
>> One way how we could get resources for our activities and even money
>> for some modest "wages" would be to run dedicated crowdsourcing
>> campaigns for given activity/project with clear statement that for
>> example 30% of the funds will be dedicated to the payments to the
>> people who will do the work on this project. From my point of view it
>> is an honest thing to do, nothing bad to feel about and it would help
>> a lot (for example on my side), also it could still keep the fhb main
>> project voluntary etc. An example could be the experimental incubator
>> project for example, or establishing the food hacking base forum which
>> we talk about for a while. I would not suggest at least for the moment
>> any personal vages etc. for the organization of the main events like
>> CCC events and the bulk of the fhb activities. Also for the "wages" or
>> personal payments if we go that way in the future I would strongly
>> argue to set them in the manner that they are of a such hight that if
>> you are after money, you would not become interested, realizing that
>> you can get for example double wages in another project etc. In other
>> words it should appeal to the really interested people so they could
>> do what they believe in and cover their bills.
>>
>> Please do note that by the late spring we plan to be done with
>> building the fermentation facility, small hacker/open space and
>> residency here in Jeju and it is my hope to make this available to
>> people to come and collaborate. Of course running some crowdsourcing
>> campaign or something like that to get some resources for the building
>> activities, energies etc. would be lovely. However this could help to
>> some people to become more active and keep their expenses minimal when
>> doing so. Similar places and communities I would love to initiate in
>> Europe and other places, sharing resources etc. This one is kind of a
>> prototype or a real life field experiment :-) And yes all of this is
>> being done and funded from my and Eunha's personal finances, energy
>> and time and I wish I could do this way faster but did not have
>> resources and I hope to change that because I think having "real food
>> hacking base facility" is just cool and so much can be done!
>>
>> Anyway I think that you hit Kai the nail on the head, lets see what
>> the others think discussion is opened seems to me :-)
>>
>> Sincerely from Jeju,
>>
>> Frantisek
>>
>> PS Maybe it would be good just to send the responses to the list so we
>> do not copy everyone, who wants to stay tuned in is on the list by
>> know anyway
>>
>> On 2015-02-22 00:32, Kai Du wrote:
>>> Hi everyone,
>>>
>>> the discussion about financial aspects of the FHB raised a question:
>>> I
>>> really would like to join - is there some kind of organisation
>>> associated to the FHB? Is there a membership fee, or anything
>>> similar?
>>> Or is the financial stuff connected to the events and further events?
>>>
>>> Greetings,
>>> Kai
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Am 21.02.2015 um 13:21 schrieb Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck:
>>>> Lovely Marcel, thanks! I've added percentages to the type of
>>>> expenses just for orientation.
>>>>
>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>
>>>> FAA
>>>>
>>>> On 2015-02-21 19:42, Marcel van der Peijl wrote:
>>>>>> We worked on that with Marcel, we are basically done, numbers
>>>>>> quite
>>>>> fit now we have found a major flaw - 250 eu expense not
>>>>> added/missing in
>>>>> the financial charts for wood and materials which we bought from
>>>>> CCC.
>>>>> Final number should be online tomorrow or even late today, up dated
>>>>> sheets are here.
>>>>>
>>>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1Bj_60w8B7EmbdfyCZSivt-29vKM1ZA22c6bSuafwCZc/edit#gid=0
>>>>>> Our final profit from the event will be around 250 eu, plus 360 eu
>>>>> frozen on my PayPal account and 50 eu in bitcoins, which totals at
>>>>> 670
>>>>> eu food hacking base ready for the next event and projects.
>>>>>
>>>>> The sheet is not fully finalized, I suspect there may be two
>>>>> corrections missing but they roughly cancel out, but will make a
>>>>> change in workshop vs other cost. I grouped the expenses (end of
>>>>> sheet) into different categories to show where money went -
>>>>> inventory,
>>>>> transport, food ingredients, and workshop-specific expenses.
>>>>> (whiskeytasting was expensive! But it did bring in almost all the
>>>>> money of day1, I counted before and after the event, so roughly
>>>>> break
>>>>> even on that one - must be kept cheaper next time).
>>>>>
>>>>> I also did not patch up frantiseks subsheet, sorry.
>>>>>
>>>>> I will be preparing a sheet with our total budget/balance, and a
>>>>> new
>>>>> sheet for upcoming event. "big spenders" like me and frantisek will
>>>>> get their own subsheet, and I will try to eliminate the need for
>>>>> double entries like there was on this one.
>>>>>
>>>>> Marcel
>>>>
>>>
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>>
>
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--
Frantisek Algoldor Apfelbeck
biotechnologist&kvasir and hacker
http://www.frantisekapfelbeck.org
"There is no way to peace, peace is the way." Mohandas Karamchand Gandhi
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