[hs-equality] People at Metalab have taken issue with some incidents at 29c3

[Koen Martens]

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On Sat, Jan 05, 2013 at 05:33:12PM +0100, Erinn Clark wrote:
> * Koen Martens <gmc at hackerspaces.org> [2013:01:05 17:17 +0100]: 
> > I mean, at some point I understood that perfectly normal conversation at 29c3
> > was perceived as 'sexist' because one word used had also a double meaning
> > that could be taken as sexist. So now you can not say anything anymore. Let's
> > just all shut up and cancel all events, that's the only way we can be sure
> > no-one can think of anything as sexist. The creeper cards and the extremist
> > beliefs behind them are simply terrorism.
> 
> I haven't really been involved in the conversation about 29c3 despite being a
> feminist female hacker, but this above comment is really... strange to me. You
> can say all kinds of things without being sexist. And the idea that we should
> shut up and cancel all events because of this tricky conversation is itself a
> pretty extreme position to take.
> 
> But overall I think that most feminists are actually level-headed and just
> don't like having the conversations about women's equality hijacked. That
> doesn't mean there isn't room for, or lack of interest in, other conversations
> about equality -- it just means that one should not interrupt others. I'm
> pretty sure the majority of people who are opposed to the harassment of women
> are also opposed to the harassment of men and people who identify as both,
> neither, or somewhere in between, they've just chosen to limit their focus.
> (At least this is true for me. I'm not a homosexual man so I don't know what
> challenges you face, but I would listen to & support you.) But you should start
> that conversation separately rather than yelling at (or about) feminists who
> started a different one.

I'm not a woman, but i'm ready to listen and support women who face sexism. Up to 
the point that said women claim that i should shut up, because 'fags are even worse
than macho men' (literally said to me in such debate) and that anything else than
sexism against women is no issue at all and should not be included at all in any
policy for $event. That's the point where it's not feminism anymore, but sexism in
itself. I think at least. Equality should include everyone, not just women. And
the whole movement behind the creeper cards is, to me, extremist and misplaced and
exclusive and not something I want to have anything to do with.

- - gmc

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