[hackerspaces] Refugee Memberships...

Randall Arnold randall.arnold at texrat.net
Wed Dec 2 17:32:15 CET 2015 

The thing is, Matt, your original remark came off as utterly dismissive, not
qualitative.  It seems now that you didn't mean it that way... but as someone
who just knows you through your writings here and elsewhere, I was surprised to
see it.

Moving on.

Randy

> On December 2, 2015 at 10:27 AM matt <matt at nycresistor.com> wrote:
> 
>     Danyelle, we've known each other a while.  
> 
>     And I can tell you that the 'hood' in the US for the most part is
> lightyears different from the 'hood' in most of the undeveloped world.  Pretty
> sure you realize that.  And I'm not saying joe/sally kid from anywhere can't
> learn.  Every kid can.  But sally and joe adult who have had a lifetime to
> grow and solidify who they are are not about to get down and dirty with the
> bitscape while facing off with all the shit in the world being thrown at them.
> 
> 
>     Rest of thread,
> 
>     And while I will agree there are no doubt bad ass syrian developers /
> hackers out there.  Most folks will not have any exposure to technology or the
> fundamentals necessary to succeed with it.  I am not saying don't try.  I am
> saying be prepared to go a hell of a lot slower than you ever have before.
>  And be prepared to realize you are not equipped or prepared to deal with what
> you get.  And yes our refuge process is expensive and time consuming resulting
> usually in allowing in only the most resolute and prepared.  But, that's no
> reason to go making assumptions about anything.
> 
>     If you can push on through and succeed.  Happy happy Joy joy etc.  If not,
> well... lessons can be learned if you document the experience.
> 
>     Not saying don't try.  Just, be ready for something very different from
> what you envision and a hell of a lot more frustrating.  I had a co-worker
> like a decade and a bit back.  From a small town in backwater bumblefuck
> kenya.  He was the next in line for the tribal leadership so the tribe got
> together and paid to get him educated in America.  Kid went into software, and
> I met him as a bad ass j2ee dev.  Fun dude.  He never went home ( aside from
> visits), but did buy them a ton of cattle every year.  But, he explained to me
> once that his grandmother would never believe that he'd been aboard an
> airplane.  The idea was anathema to what she knew of the world.  And that sort
> of anathema is HARD to get people to climb over.  Especially in adverse
> conditions.  That's what I've experienced in undeveloped countries.  And
> that's something I think the US and Europe largely do not have a notion of.
> 
>     -Matt
> 
> 
>     On Wed, Dec 2, 2015 at 11:17 AM, Danyelle Davis <ddavis at codetemptress.net
> mailto:ddavis at codetemptress.net > wrote:
> 
>         > > 
> >         Funny thing is.. when I started in the computer industry someone was
> > surprised that there are "computer people in the hood".  Just because the
> > area may not be known for it doesn't mean interest isn't there.  Just the
> > right materials is needed. 
> > 
> > 
> >         On Wed, Dec 2, 2015, 11:13 AM Sam Ley <sam.ley at gmail.com
> > mailto:sam.ley at gmail.com > wrote:
> > 
> >             > > >             I appreciate that some hackerspaces are
> >             > > > looking for ways to become a good resource for resettling
> >             > > > refugees. I have a friend who spent many years
> >             > > > volunteering with refugee resettlement groups here in
> >             > > > Colorado and always reminded people how much refugees are
> >             > > > disconnected from the basic services of society, and how
> >             > > > just introductions to people and services in the community
> >             > > > means a lot for their successful resettlement.
> > > 
> > >             Regarding tech bases, Syrians in general are quite a bit
> > > better educated than the neighboring countries - until recently it was
> > > considered prosperous for the region. And since it takes resources to
> > > flee, we are getting the most educated groups - among adult Syrian
> > > refugees admitted to the US, their level of education is higher than the
> > > US population at large, meaning if you approached a group of adult Syrian
> > > refugees for hackerspace membership, you'd be more likely to get college
> > > educated people than if you approached a random group of US citizens.
> > > 
> > >             Syria may not have a huge tech industry or a lot of exports
> > > (certainly not now), but that doesn't mean the citizens are dumb, or
> > > otherwise not interested in or in need of educational resources once they
> > > arrive.
> > > 
> > > 
> > >            http://www.newsweek.com/who-exactly-are-syrian-refugees-we-have-already-taken-397795
> > > 
> > >            https://www.insidehighered.com/news/2015/09/25/syrian-refugee-crisis-and-higher-education
> > > 
> > >             -Sam
> > > 
> > >             On Wed, Dec 2, 2015 at 9:00 AM, Danyelle Davis
> > > <ddavis at codetemptress.net mailto:ddavis at codetemptress.net > wrote:
> > > 
> > >                 > > > > 
> > > >                 Lol wow.
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > >                 On Wed, Dec 2, 2015, 10:59 AM Danilo <mail at dbrgn.ch
> > > > mailto:mail at dbrgn.ch > wrote:
> > > > 
> > > >                     > > > > >                     Am Mi, 2. Dez 2015, um
> > > >                     > > > > > 10:44, schrieb matt:
> > > > > 
> > > > >                         > > > > > >                         Syria is
> > > > >                         > > > > > > not known for it's tech base.
> > > > > > 
> > > > > >                     > > > > >                      
> > > > >                     Yeah, people form Syria are primitive people that
> > > > > dwell in caves and don't have any education whatsoever.
> > > > >                      
> > > > >                     https://wiki.hackerspaces.org/Syria
> > > > >                      
> > > > >                     Cheerio from the enlightened central Europe
> > > > >                     _______________________________________________
> > > > >                     Discuss mailing list
> > > > >                     Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
> > > > > mailto:Discuss at lists.hackerspaces.org
> > > > > 
> > > > >                    http://lists.hackerspaces.org/mailman/listinfo/discuss
> > > > > 
> > > > >                 > > > > 
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> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > >             > > > 
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> > > 
> > >         > > 
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> > 
> >     > 
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