<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 7:43 AM, Sam Tobin <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:sam.tobin@nrsnz.com" target="_blank">sam.tobin@nrsnz.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Diminishing return guys/girls...<div><br></div><div>I've worked on large ESA projects with massive overheads and scrutiny, and on tiny garage-based projects. Accountability, workplans etc are tools... and as always one needs the right tools for the task at hand.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>I'm not sure where in any of these I implied that scrutiny is an end in itself. I certainly don't view it that way.</div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div><br></div><div>I've also worked for a philanthropist group, and (might be unique, but maybe not)... </div></div></blockquote><div><br>Not unique, but .... the watchword these days in philianthropy these days is "metrics". Which I'm sure everybody hates. Why? Too much money into too little good done.</div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div>they were mostly interested in outcomes, not details.</div></div></blockquote><div><br>One person's mere detail is another's outcome. </div><div><br>Measuring what comes out is pretty meaningless if you don't also measure what goes in. I once paid a guy $2000 to code up a module for a database project for a small business client. I trusted the guy. I figured he knew the technology better than I did. It turned out, the function he wrote for me was already available in the database system we were using. I felt stupid, it hurt, and it also hurt the client -- I was in no situation to eat the waste, I just had to pass the cost on and hope nobody ever probed into the system and made an issue of it.<br><br>Trust is great grease. You can move faster with it. But sometimes it puts you on the skids toward corruption.</div><div><br></div><div>With SpaceGAMBIT, $20,000 went to a group that promised open source but never checked in a single line of code. It seems that nobody was watching, nobody was setting milestones, or noticing delays in reaching them. It seemed that nobody cared. It was "free" money from taxpayers. DARPA was used to a high failure rate, so who would care if it failed? Don't get in the team's way with all this bureaucracy of accountability. No, think about their creative needs. What if the reporting requirements made them all depressed or something?</div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div>Simply put, the approach was to trust the person/group, check outcomes, repeat with person/group at larger $ scale if good.</div></div></blockquote><div><br></div><div>Check outcomes against ... what reasonable expectation, given the inputs? Trust based on ... what, initially? You're telling me nobody was ever looking at a schedule to make sure it wasn't egregiously padded? Nobody was ever looking at procurement requests to see if the item was really needed? You had no such process? And everything was peachy?<br><br>Excuse me, that's a little hard to believe. I've seen it work in startups where we could all see each other across a big room, all knew each other fairly well, very "flat" hierarchy, all invested in success of the product, not in status or comfort or "what we can get away with." It was heavenly. But it didn't last. Because the VC's idea of success is a company that reaches altitude and stays there because it /does/ have all those annoying controls.<br><br>And most startups fail. How many fail because the trade-off between precision in self-monitoring versus creative productivity wasn't right for the mission at hand? That's an intrinsically difficult thing to determine after the fact. I know.<br><br>If you paw through the ruins of one startup I was involved in, you'd find invoices for a $120/hour consultant who made us a version control system we didn't like, an expense never openly questioned at the time. You'll also find the details of initiative to control the supply cabinet more carefully, since the same manager who signed off on the $120/hour consultant also had a tendency to take mechanical pencils home and forget to bring them back. He announced the new supply cabinet policy (with his mea culpa about missing items, mind you). I pointed out that his innocent waste wasn't even a drop in the bucket of the money-gasoline that fed our burn rate. He got angry. He said, "It's the little things that kill you." No, guy: it's the big things, going unmonitored. Like that invoice from the consultant who simply added up all his hours for the past week, week after week, with one line item: "version control system." I bought my options at 10 cents a share. I got cashed out years later -- at 10 cents a share. Lesson learned: if you've got cannons rolling around on the deck, chain them to something.</div><div><br></div><div>Measures of trust, estimates of difficulty, measures of plausibility in estimates, measures of progress, measures of effectiveness of effort -- we do this all the time, every day, mostly without numbers. The degree of precision and formality changes depending on what we're doing and who we're dealing with.<br><br>You all trusted each other? That's a wonderful thing. But when you're asking for money, and nobody knows you yet, you're going to face distrust. Try it sometime, if you've forgotten. Or, try this:</div><div><br></div><div>I want $2,000 so that I can put together a really good KickStarter campaign. It's for one of my space projects. It'll be good. Trust me. You'll love the results. And you say that's all you want to look at: results. I'll send you my Paypal details. I promise you, they'll be the only details you'll need to look at, until we're done. Do we have a deal?</div><div><br></div><div><div><div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Regards,<br>Michael Turner<br>Executive Director<br>Project Persephone<br>K-1 bldg 3F<br>7-2-6 Nishishinjuku<br>Shinjuku-ku Tokyo 160-0023<br>Tel: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1140" value="+81368901140" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1140</a><br>Fax: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1158" value="+81368901158" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1158</a><br>Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%2890%29%205203-8682" value="+819052038682" target="_blank">+81 (90) 5203-8682</a><br><a href="mailto:turner@projectpersephone.org" target="_blank">turner@projectpersephone.org</a><br><a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank">http://www.projectpersephone.org/</a><br><br>"Love does not consist in gazing at each other, but in looking outward together in the same direction." -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry</div></div></div><div><br></div><div> </div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr"><div><div><div><br></div><div><br></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 27 May 2016 at 05:08, Michael Turner <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com" target="_blank">michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">I'm sure that's been your experience, Matt. Subjectively, it has also been mine. I've chafed under accountability frameworks in almost every organization I've ever been in. They've always felt like a "massive, worthless drain."<br><br>Here's the thing, though: the ones that didn't have them, fell apart. Sometimes in very embarrassing ways. And one thing I've learned in trying to work with nonprofits in some parts of the world is that if you ask for accountability, and get only indignation in response, you're better off turning away and not bothering with those people ever again. They are on the take. I don't want to be like them. When potential donors say, "I need to look at how you spend money," I want to be in a position throw all the verification at them that they could possibly want, and more. They'll want to know that the level of parasitism in my organization is acceptably low. How can I blame them?<br><br>Permit a biological metaphor: a fair amount of any creature's metabolism goes into supporting its immune system. It's a lot. It's a massive, worthless drain, actually. Until there's an infection, or a cluster of mutant cells that might turn into a malignant tumor. <br><div><br></div></div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><div data-smartmail="gmail_signature">Regards,<br>Michael Turner<br>Executive Director<br>Project Persephone<br>K-1 bldg 3F<br>7-2-6 Nishishinjuku<br>Shinjuku-ku Tokyo 160-0023<br>Tel: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1140" value="+81368901140" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1140</a><br>Fax: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1158" value="+81368901158" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1158</a><br>Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%2890%29%205203-8682" value="+819052038682" target="_blank">+81 (90) 5203-8682</a><br><a href="mailto:turner@projectpersephone.org" target="_blank">turner@projectpersephone.org</a><br><a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank">http://www.projectpersephone.org/</a><br><br>"Love does not consist in gazing at each other, but in looking outward together in the same direction." -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry</div></div>
<br><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 1:26 AM, Silence Dogood <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:matt@nycresistor.com" target="_blank">matt@nycresistor.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">In my experience, working for a space agency, people who are interested in "<span style="color:rgb(80,0,80);font-size:12.8px">setting up a framework in which every iota of effort on funded projects can be tracked, and every penny of spending can be recorded.</span>" are usually a massive worthless drain on the project and very interested in inserting themselves in places they have no earthly business being, just to justify their continued leeching upon the project. And, more often then not, they cost more than they benefit anyone... not just in fiduciary cost, but in time, complexity, and general nuisance factor introduced into the day to day operational workflow of the group working on the project.<div><br></div><div>-Matt</div></div><div><div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 12:13 PM, Michael Turner <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com" target="_blank">michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">Matt, in my experience of hackerspaces, there's lots of bitter argument by people who aren't contributing much of anything, much of the time. I tried. Eventually, I walked. I contributed time, money, equipment, project ideas ... but ultimately, I walked. I felt pretty alienated by know-it-all attitudes and a kind of knee-jerk anti-authoritarianism that prefers unproductive chaos to reasonable order.<br><br>So, again:<span><br><br><span style="font-size:12.8px">I'm interested in setting up a framework in which every iota of effort on funded projects can be tracked, and every penny of spending can be recorded. I'm interested in this because I'll need donors at some point, and donors typically require high transparency -- and results. I'd like to hear from makerspace leaders who've been successful at setting up such frameworks.</span><br><div><br></div><div><br></div></span></div><div class="gmail_extra"><span><br clear="all"><div><div>Regards,<br>Michael Turner<br>Executive Director<br>Project Persephone<br>K-1 bldg 3F<br>7-2-6 Nishishinjuku<br>Shinjuku-ku Tokyo 160-0023<br>Tel: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1140" value="+81368901140" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1140</a><br>Fax: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1158" value="+81368901158" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1158</a><br>Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%2890%29%205203-8682" value="+819052038682" target="_blank">+81 (90) 5203-8682</a><br><a href="mailto:turner@projectpersephone.org" target="_blank">turner@projectpersephone.org</a><br><a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank">http://www.projectpersephone.org/</a><br><br>"Love does not consist in gazing at each other, but in looking outward together in the same direction." -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry</div></div>
<br></span><div><div><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 1:08 AM, Silence Dogood <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:matt@nycresistor.com" target="_blank">matt@nycresistor.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">In open source, committers walk and everyone else talks... and is promptly ignored. If you think something can be done better, do it better. Leadership is an act of demonstrating a better path forward. Decrying folks is not productive. We know success when we see it, everything else is just more of the same.<div><br></div><div>So, stop bitching, and go make a difference.</div><div><br></div><div>-Matt</div></div><div><div><div class="gmail_extra"><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, May 26, 2016 at 12:03 PM, Michael Turner <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com" target="_blank">michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"><div dir="ltr">"<span style="font-size:12.8px">You have to admit, Michael, that nearly every email you've sent </span><span style="font-size:12.8px">has been a slash and burn."<br></span><br>I'm destructive? What's more destructive: criticism of corruption, or corruption?</div><div class="gmail_extra"><span><br clear="all"><div><div>Regards,<br>Michael Turner<br>Executive Director<br>Project Persephone<br>K-1 bldg 3F<br>7-2-6 Nishishinjuku<br>Shinjuku-ku Tokyo 160-0023<br>Tel: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1140" value="+81368901140" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1140</a><br>Fax: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1158" value="+81368901158" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1158</a><br>Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%2890%29%205203-8682" value="+819052038682" target="_blank">+81 (90) 5203-8682</a><br><a href="mailto:turner@projectpersephone.org" target="_blank">turner@projectpersephone.org</a><br><a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank">http://www.projectpersephone.org/</a><br><br>"Love does not consist in gazing at each other, but in looking outward together in the same direction." -- Antoine de Saint-Exupéry</div></div>
<br></span><div><div><div class="gmail_quote">On Fri, May 27, 2016 at 12:57 AM, David <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:ainut@hiwaay.net" target="_blank">ainut@hiwaay.net</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div text="#000000" bgcolor="#FFFFFF">
You have to admit, Michael, that nearly every email you've sent <br>
<br>
<div>On 05/18/2016 11:02 AM, cole santos
wrote:has been a slash and burn.<br>
<br>
David Merchant<br>
<br>
<br>
</div><div><div>
<blockquote type="cite">
<p dir="ltr">Lol you just don't get it troll<br>
</p>
<div class="gmail_quote">On May 18, 2016 1:03 AM, "Michael Turner"
<<a href="mailto:michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com" target="_blank">michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br type="attribution">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">"<span style="font-size:12.8px">Mike no one
wanted to work with you because of emails like you just
sent."<br>
</span><br>
I thought there should be more openness and oversight, and
so nobody wanted to work with me? Interesting. I hadn't
realized that openness and oversight were such unpopular
things when spending taxpayers money. Unless, of course,
you're a taxpayer. Are you?<br>
<br>
"<span style="font-size:12.8px">Since I wrote the grant, and
got the Corp formed, and followed through until the
project start, I think it's ok moraly."<br>
</span><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br>
I always assumed an education in philosophy would acquaint
a person with the difference between morals and ethics.
You learn something every day, I guess.</span><span style="font-size:12.8px"><br>
<br>
<br>
</span></div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div>Regards,<br>
Michael Turner<br>
Executive Director<br>
Project Persephone<br>
K-1 bldg 3F<br>
7-2-6 Nishishinjuku<br>
Shinjuku-ku Tokyo 160-0023<br>
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1140" value="+81368901140" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1140</a><br>
Fax: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1158" value="+81368901158" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1158</a><br>
Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%2890%29%205203-8682" value="+819052038682" target="_blank">+81 (90)
5203-8682</a><br>
<a href="mailto:turner@projectpersephone.org" target="_blank">turner@projectpersephone.org</a><br>
<a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank">http://www.projectpersephone.org/</a><br>
<br>
"Love does not consist in gazing at each other, but in
looking outward together in the same direction." --
Antoine de Saint-Exupéry</div>
</div>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, May 18, 2016 at 1:48 AM,
cole santos <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:cksantos85@gmail.com" target="_blank">cksantos85@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<p dir="ltr">Mike no one wanted to work with you because
of emails like you just sent. We are amateurs hacking
it. Ps haesh was my project and it was somewhat a
sweetheart deal. I had to choose between a project or
a job. Since I wrote the grant, and got the Corp
formed, and followed through until the project start,
I think it's ok moraly. The other projects were all
random submissions. The principal aka jerry got
overwhelmed and didn't even really want the job. I
kinda forced it on him as I had a full time job.
Reality is not nearly as sensational as u wish.</p>
<div>
<div>
<div class="gmail_quote">On May 16, 2016 9:07 PM,
"Michael Turner" <<a href="mailto:michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com" target="_blank">michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br type="attribution">
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div class="gmail_extra">First things first:</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br>
I'm interested in setting up a framework in
which every iota of effort on funded
projects can be tracked, and every penny of
spending can be recorded. I'm interested in
this because I'll need donors at some point,
and donors typically require high
transparency -- and results. I'd like to
hear from makerspace leaders who've been
successful at setting up such frameworks.<br>
<br>
Now, about the "drama":<br>
<br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, May 17,
2016 at 2:51 AM, gmc <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:gmc@hackerspaces.org" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:gmc@hackerspaces.org" target="_blank">gmc@hackerspaces.org</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>Yay, drama. It's what hackers are
best at! Bye bye mailing list.<br>
</div>
</blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Clearly, some disillusionment and
malaise has set in.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Hackerspaces.org? No blog update
since just about two years ago.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Interesting critique there, though:</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div> <a href="https://flux.hackerspaces.org/2014/01/19/diversity-and-the-hacker-scene/" target="_blank">https://flux.hackerspaces.org/2014/01/19/diversity-and-the-hacker-scene/</a></div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Drama will never go away permanently.
Sometimes the only way to quell drama is
with rules.<br>
<br>
If you're going to have rules, you can
try counting on ideas like legitimizing
all decisions through the rule of
relying on consensus (it always breaks
down). Or on rules set by some
"benevolent oligarchy" (the "oligarchs"
often get tired of arbitration and
moderation, and go missing.) There are a
variety of other dodges of the basic
responsibility of collective governance,
which is tedious and stressful compared
to making things.<br>
<br>
In the case of SpaceGAMBIT, the dodge
took the form of locating all authority
over spending that $500,000 in a tiny
handful of people who operated in a
pretty opaque fashion. In at least one
case, the opacity was defended by a
SpaceGAMBIT principal in terms of
DARPA's tight regulations about the
release of information. When I asked for
chapter and verse of those regulations,
there was no answer. Wait: you're saying
you got money from a government agency
that doesn't tell taxpayers the basis on
which it allows awarded organizations to
release information about how taxpayer
money is being spent? Interesting.<br>
<br>
Given the nature of the political
differences over taking money from
DARPA, I can see a reason for not
identifying winning teams when the
awards went out. It might have been
defensible as a way to protect the
awarded teams from harassment by those
who were most loudly opposed to that
money, and to what any hackerspace group
taking that money symbolized to them. <br>
<br>
The problem was: opacity could enable
sweetheart deals. Waste. Lax controls.<br>
<br>
And what do we have at the end?<br>
<br>
Examples:<br>
<br>
$20,000 for an open source satellite
mission design project that apparently
never checked anything into a repo.<br>
<br>
The HAESH project, which, by some odd
coincidence, was based in Hawaii. (And
apparently on Maui.)That was
statistically unlikely, especially when
you consider that the main SpaceGAMBIT
executive exulted at one point about how
great it was to work internationally,
not just in America, and not just in his
tiny home region of -- you guessed it --
Hawaii. Maui, in fact.<br>
<br>
How about the thousands of dollars for
the open source Make-a-Space Kit? It had
a laudable goal.<br>
<br>
"The goal of this project is to complete
the content--finalize the entire kit--
and then create a turn-key online
template which a new or existing space
can use to instantiate
the online project management, assign
specific tasks to board members, track
accountability,
and effectively communicate about the
status of the activities as the space is
launched and
formed."<br>
<br>
Where is it? Dead links on the
SpaceGAMBIT site. Try to get something
back from the Wayback Machine?
Unsuccessful.<br>
<br>
How about that Asteroid Badge? <br>
<br>
<a href="https://github.com/CuriosityHacked/Learning/wiki/SpaceAsteroids" target="_blank">https://github.com/CuriosityHacked/Learning/wiki/SpaceAsteroids</a><br>
<br>
There's something in there that looks
like a rough draft of Make-a-Space Kit,
but certainly nothing that looks
"finalized."<br>
<br>
Thousands of dollars spent on those two
projects. And this is all there is to
show for it?<br>
<br>
It's what happens when there's no
openness or accountability, and when
money can be spent without significant
oversight by a small group of people.<br>
<br>
So, to repeat my request:<br>
<br>
I'm interested in setting up a framework
in which every iota of effort on funded
projects can be tracked, and every penny
of spending can be recorded. I'm
interested in this because I'll need
donors at some point, and donors
typically require high transparency --
and results. I'd like to hear from
makerspace leaders who've been
successful at setting up such
frameworks.<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Regards,<br>
Michael Turner<br>
Executive Director<br>
Project Persephone<br>
K-1 bldg 3F<br>
7-2-6 Nishishinjuku<br>
Shinjuku-ku Tokyo 160-0023<br>
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1140" value="+81368901140" target="_blank">+81
(3) 6890-1140</a><br>
Fax: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1158" value="+81368901158" target="_blank">+81
(3) 6890-1158</a><br>
Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%2890%29%205203-8682" value="+819052038682" target="_blank">+81
(90) 5203-8682</a><br>
<a href="mailto:turner@projectpersephone.org" target="_blank">turner@projectpersephone.org</a><br>
<a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank">http://www.projectpersephone.org/</a><br>
<br>
"Love does not consist in gazing at each
other, but in looking outward together
in the same direction." -- Antoine de
Saint-Exupéry<br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div><br>
<div class="gmail_quote"><span>On 16
May 2016 18:26:04 CEST, Michael
Turner <<a href="mailto:michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com" target="_blank">michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:</span>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div dir="ltr">
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra">
<div class="gmail_quote"><span>On
Tue, May 17, 2016 at 12:55
AM, cole santos <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:cksantos85@gmail.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:cksantos85@gmail.com" target="_blank">cksantos85@gmail.com</a>></span>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">Actually
we took the DarPA money
and the project was a
great success. <a href="http://Www.spacegambit.Com" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://Www.spacegambit.Com" target="_blank">Www.spacegambit.Com</a></blockquote>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>A great success for
some people, I suppose.
In a certain sense.<br>
<br>
I pick a project at
random.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><a href="http://www.spacegambit.org/satstatsim/" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://www.spacegambit.org/satstatsim/" target="_blank">http://www.spacegambit.org/satstatsim/</a></div>
</span>
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><span>Funding:
$20,000<br>
<br>
SpaceGAMBIT claim:
only open source
projects will be
funded.
<div><br>
</div>
</span>
<div>Reality: well, ta!
ke a
look.<br>
<br>
<a href="http://satstatsim.blogspot.jp/" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://satstatsim.blogspot.jp/" target="_blank">http://satstatsim.blogspot.jp/</a></div>
<div>
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Excuse:
"schedules slip".
OK, but you can't
check in any code,
anywhere?</div>
<div><br>
<a href="https://code.google.com/archive/p/satstatsim/source" target="_blank"></a><a href="https://code.google.com/archive/p/satstatsim/source" target="_blank">https://code.google.com/archive/p/satstatsim/source</a><br>
<br>
At least, that's
the only repo I
could find.</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>There's nothing in
it.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>It was largely
because of my concerns
about openness, clear
communication,
democratic process,
and leadership
accountability that I
decided to have
nothing further to do
with SpaceGAMBIT. This
was after feeling
enthusiastic about it
and even defending it
against what I thought
was unfair criticism.</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div>Really, I'd prefer
to have been wrong in
my suspicions.</div>
<div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all">
<div>
<div>Regards,<br>
Michael Turner<br>
Executive
Director<br>
Project
Persephone<br>
K-1 bldg 3F<br>
7-2-6
Nishishinjuku<br>
Shinjuku-ku
Tokyo 160-0023<br>
Tel: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1140" value="+81368901140" target="_blank">+81
(3) 6890-1140</a><br>
Fax: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1158" value="+81368901158" target="_blank">+81
(3) 6890-1158</a><br>
Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%2890%29%205203-8682" value="+819052038682" target="_blank">+81
(90) 5203-8682</a><br>
<a href="mailto:turner@projectpersephone.org" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:turner@projectpersephone.org" target="_blank">turner@projectpersephone.org</a><br>
<a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank">http://www.projectpersephone.org/</a><br>
<br>
"Love does not
consist in
gazing at each
other, but in
looking outward
together in the
same direction."
-- Antoine de
Saint-Exupéry</div>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div><br>
</div>
<div> </div>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex"> </blockquote>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
<div>
<div>
<div><br>
On Monday, May
16, 2016,
Michael P Weber
II <<a href="mailto:michaelweberii@gmail.com" target="_blank"></a><a href="mailto:michaelweberii@gmail.com" target="_blank">michaelweberii@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left-width:1px;border-left-style:solid;border-left-color:rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">On
Mon, May 16,
2016 at 3:05
AM, Michael
Turner<br>
<<a></a><a href="mailto:michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com" target="_blank">michael.eugene.turner@gmail.com</a>>
wrote:<br>
> Whether
intentional or
not, the
choice of
watercress
could be very<br>
>
space-relevant.<br>
><br>
> (1)
Biosphere II
saw the direct
participation
of the late
Roy Walford,
MD, a<br>
> pioneer
self-experimenter
in CRON
(calorie
restriction
with optimal<br>
>
nutrition) as
a strategy for
life
extension.
This research
interested the<br>
> Biosphere
II organizers
because, in
feeding
long-duration
space mission<br>
>
participants,
fewer calories
eaten means,
to a good
first
approximation,<br>
> less mass
for the
ecological
life support
system,
leading to
lower mission<br>
> cost,
etc.<br>
><br>
> (2)
Research into
how CRON
appears to
increase
lifespans (in
part by<br>
> reducing
cancer risk --
a big issue in
space travel
because of
space<br>
>
radiation)
reveals that
it's more
about protein
restriction
than about<br>
> calorie
restriction
per se.<br>
><br>
> (3)
Further
research has
suggested that
it's
specifically
reduction of<br>
>
methionine
intake that is
the main
driver of life
extension in
CRON (hence,<br>
>
presumably,
lower cancer
risk);<br>
><br>
> (4)
High-glycine
diets sop up
excess
methionine.
(To be sure:
methionine is<br>
> an
essential
amino acid;
glycine is
not. But it
seems that
with
methionine,<br>
> you can
get too much
of a good
thing.)<br>
><br>
> (5)
Watercress is
very high in
glycine, quite
low in
methionine.
Watercress<br>
> might be
ideal for
offsetting the
cancer risks
from space
radiation in<br>
>
long-duration
space
missions.<br>
><br>
> I think a
good next step
in such work
would be to
try to
optimize
watercress<br>
>
production in
an aeroponic
rather than a
hydroponic
style.
Hydroponics is<br>
> great,
highly
productive,
but ... water
is heavy.
Aeroponics can
give you<br>
> much of
the benefit of
hydroponics
but with a
fraction of
the equipment<br>
> mass.
Aeroponics
should be more
adaptable to
low-g and
microgravity<br>
>
environments
since it's not
gravity-dependent
-- it's
basically just
the<br>
>
deposition of
nutrient-enriched
mist droplets
on plant
roots.
Aeroponics may<br>
> have
gotten its
start from
NASA funding.<br>
><br>
><br>
> Regards,<br>
> Michael
Turner<br>
> Executive
Director<br>
> Project
Persephone<br>
> K-1 bldg
3F<br>
> 7-2-6
Nishishinjuku<br>
>
Shinjuku-ku
Tokyo 160-0023<br>
> Tel: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1140" value="+81368901140" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1140</a><br>
> Fax: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%283%29%206890-1158" value="+81368901158" target="_blank">+81 (3) 6890-1158</a><br>
> Mobile: <a href="tel:%2B81%20%2890%29%205203-8682" value="+819052038682" target="_blank">+81 (90) 5203-8682</a><br>
> <a></a><a href="mailto:turner@projectpersephone.org" target="_blank">turner@projectpersephone.org</a><br>
> <a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://www.projectpersephone.org/" target="_blank">http://www.projectpersephone.org/</a><br>
><br>
> "Love
does not
consist in
gazing at each
other, but in
looking
outward<br>
> together
in the same
direction." --
Antoine de
Saint-Exupéry<br>
><br>
> On Mon,
May 16, 2016
at 4:35 PM,
Michael Turner<br>
<br>
<br>
Michael,<br>
<br>
Are you going
to take over
the list then?<br>
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