Hi Huei Ming,<div><br></div><div>Nice to meet you :)</div><div><br></div><div>>Interesting stuff you've suggested for the educational component Jerry. </div><div>>I guess that could go under the Statement of Work section! </div>
<div><br></div><div>Yes, it could go there, but it's also IMO, a fundamental approach concept, aligned well with Hackerspace culture and thinking, and should be represented in the vision. </div><div><br></div><div><br>
</div><div>>For one, I've been writing up a comprehensive Vision section for the RFP and the link is at</div><div>> <a href="https://docs.google.com/open?id=1GPi0fJZ_ijVNdhOm1kWDDAVoJyZRM7QHLViSM0RNEcQ" target="_blank">https://docs.google.com/open?id=1GPi0fJZ_ijVNdhOm1kWDDAVoJyZRM7QHLViSM0RNEcQ</a></div>
<div>>Do have a quick look at it, and feel free to provide suggestions especially if you think I've messed up something there! </div><div><br></div><div>I enjoyed reading what you've written. What you have reads much better than the hackerspace Google document.</div>
<div>However I think it still needs work, and I have some conceptual disconnects/ differences of opinion with what you've written.</div><div><br></div><div>My primary concern is that I feel it takes way too long to get to the vision: the historical preamble is nice, but generally is death in an RFP response, particularly when reviewers typically have limited time on their hands and you are competing for their attention against other submissions.</div>
<div><br></div><div>I'd be encouraging you to jump to the punch line as quickly as possible, and my picks - from a quick scan of what you've written - would be focusing on a theme such as "Enhancing humanity’s survivability by rekindling our passionate history of exploration through the enablement of long-distance manned spaceflight." and quickly highlight the intention to "Push our social and technological limits to harness the resources in space for us to survive and coexist in space will spur the innovation needed in a time of urgent challenges, resource constraints and the need to get along in an increasingly crowded environment.". I think the historical context is entertaining additional reading, and supports that vision, but you need to distill the essence down into a coherent, concise and punchy vision, and relegate the detailed history to a subsection, possibly an appendix.</div>
<div><br></div><div>My other key concern is that I have mixed feelings about your conclusion (based on the Albert Einstein reference of spending 55 minutes planning and 5 minutes executing) that significantly more time should be spend planning than executing. Maker/ Hacker culture is often characterised by folks who get in and "tinker": trying things out, watching them fail, learning from their mistakes, and trying again. So planning, design and execution are intimately entwined and it's often hard to see where one starts and the other ends. My feeling is a maker-lead initiative would probably get a starship platform operational very quickly using this approach, get the thing moving through space somewhere, and them simply make whatever was needed from the resources at hand and harvested along the way. Obviously the actual execution would most likely have considerable planning to get to that point, however I wanted to make the observation that iterative prototyping and deployment and actually trying to execute as early as possible was an equally valid strategy and one better aligned to maker/ Hacker culture.</div>
<div><br><br>Paul<br> <br>Paul Szymkowiak <br><div><a href="http://hackmelbourne.org/" target="_blank">HackMelbourne.org</a></div><div><br></div><div>skype:paul.szym?call<br><a href="http://www.linkedin.com/in/paulszym" target="_blank">linkedin.com/in/paulszym</a></div>
<div><a href="http://gplus.to/paulzee" target="_blank">gplus.to/paulzee</a></div><div><a href="http://twitter.com/paulzee" target="_blank">twitter.com/paulzee</a></div><div><a href="http://twitter.com/smartenergywins" target="_blank"></a><a href="http://twitter.com/hackmelbourne" target="_blank">twitter.com/hackmelbourne</a><br>
TimeZone: GMT +10 hours</div><br>
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On 10 November 2011 14:34, Huei Ming Tan <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:tanhueiming@gmail.com">tanhueiming@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
Hi all,<div><br></div><div>Please accept my apologies for not introducing myself earlier, I'm Huei Ming who's currently working at the National University of Singapore (my alma mater till 2010) helping to prototype and manage modules for hands on engineering projects, and working on the side with a bunch of friends to start a Sustainability Living Lab here in Singapore, which is currently housed under an NGO called the Ground-Up Initiative (do come by if you visit Singapore!). So essentially I'm the one who submitted an RFI response with a friend from Singapore, linked up with Ricky and joining forces to work on this proposal. Nothing much to contribute from my end here, since I'm pretty much the ideas guy spearheading the contribution from Singapore ans seeing if our space here can't contribute to the overall effort.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Now on to the hard stuff!</div><div><br></div><div>Interesting stuff you've suggested for the educational component Jerry. I guess that could go under the Statement of Work section! It's good that you're contributing to the cashflow section, since that's pretty much untouched so far.</div>
<div><br></div><div>For one, I've been writing up a comprehensive Vision section for the RFP and the link is at <a href="https://docs.google.com/open?id=1GPi0fJZ_ijVNdhOm1kWDDAVoJyZRM7QHLViSM0RNEcQ" target="_blank">https://docs.google.com/open?id=1GPi0fJZ_ijVNdhOm1kWDDAVoJyZRM7QHLViSM0RNEcQ</a></div>
<div>Do have a quick look at it, and feel free to provide suggestions especially if you think I've messed up something there! </div><div><br></div><div>Important things to note for submission due <b>Nov 11, 2011 5:00 pm EST</b>:</div>
<div>"Proposals may also be submitted through Grants.gov. If proposers intend to use Grants.gov as their means of submission, then they must submit their entire proposal through Grants.gov; applications cannot be submitted in part to Grants.gov and in part as a hard copy. Proposers using the Grants.gov APPLY do not submit paper proposals in addition to the Grants.gov APPLY electronic submission. The deadline for proposal submissions made using Grants.gov is the same as the hard copy deadline above."</div>
<div><br></div><div>AND</div><div><br></div><div>"Unless the offeror is exempt from this requirement, as per FAR 4.1102 or 2 CFR 25.110 as applicable, all offerors must be registered in the Central Awardee Registration (CCR) and have a valid Data Universal Numbering System (DUNS) number prior to submitting a proposal. Information on CCR registration is available at <a href="http://www.ccr.gov" target="_blank">http://www.ccr.gov</a>."</div>
<div><br></div><div>That suggests to me that yes, the grant is subject to FAR compliance unless someone wants to play lawyer and see if we can be exempted.</div><div><br></div><div>Thanks guys, and looking forward to finishing this proposal with you guys! :)</div>
<div><br clear="all">Warmest regards,<br>Huei Ming<br>
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 5:48 AM, <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:spaceprogram-request@lists.hackerspaces.org" target="_blank">spaceprogram-request@lists.hackerspaces.org</a>></span> wrote:<br>
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Today's Topics:<br>
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1. Re: 57 hours remaining to submit RFP for 100YSS (Jerry Isdale)<br>
2. Re: 57 hours remaining to submit RFP for 100YSS (Paul Szymkowiak)<br>
<br>
<br>
----------------------------------------------------------------------<br>
<br>
Message: 1<br>
Date: Wed, 9 Nov 2011 11:27:39 -1000<br>
From: Jerry Isdale <<a href="mailto:jerry@mauimakers.com" target="_blank">jerry@mauimakers.com</a>><br>
To: Hackerspaces Space Program communication list<br>
<<a href="mailto:spaceprogram@lists.hackerspaces.org" target="_blank">spaceprogram@lists.hackerspaces.org</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [SpaceProgram] 57 hours remaining to submit RFP for<br>
100YSS<br>
Message-ID: <<a href="mailto:FAE5A2B0-844A-4BF0-A487-85791C60D11C@mauimakers.com" target="_blank">FAE5A2B0-844A-4BF0-A487-85791C60D11C@mauimakers.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Glad to see the cashflow being worked, and distancing us from FAR requirements.<br>
<br>
The education component i mentioned would be to build an accessible on-line/offline set of class materials. There are lots of small uncoordinated efforts at just about every makerspace/fablab, but rarely are the materials shared CC and developed well enough for reuse by someone other than the original developers. I would love to see our 100YSS project provide and promote development of a repository of educational materials to support maker/100yss activities. I think it would help extend the reach the tech we can develop by developing more techies... and help do on-demand building/learning how to build in our near-earth and later deep space efforts.<br>
<br>
On Nov 9, 2011, at 11:12 AM, Ricky Ng-Adam wrote:<br>
<br>
> Hello Jerry!<br>
><br>
> On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 4:49 AM, Jerry Isdale <<a href="mailto:jerry@mauimakers.com" target="_blank">jerry@mauimakers.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> Aloha<br>
><br>
> I've been remiss in putting some time to this effort. I looked at and edited the g-doc proposal a bit this AM. I added myself in the participant part and updated the MauiMakers section a bit. In the Sources of Funding section, I added Crowd-Sourced (eg Kickstarter) for specific projects.<br>
><br>
> Good idea! The way I've got it setup right now is that we will have regular distributions every 3 months to a new hackerspace to cover projects to the amount of 30K$USD dollars. Obviously, additional funds to this would be important and actually could be a good way to gauge how much support and interest there is for a project. Perhaps a criteria before funding a project out of the 100YSS.<br>
><br>
> One thought I had -- the program should have an educational component - one to teach people helping in near term, and for much later when starship is enroute. This is a multi-generational effort and we need to train people up quickly. Perhaps we could sponsor some competitions to develop focused self-taught/group classes in various Maker tech... rapid prototype machines, 3d design for rapid manufacturing, microelectronics (arduino, general electronics), troubleshooting, programming etc. The course materials would be CC licensed and available through the organization to further the development of other projects. We could/should have educational component to most of the other projects so as to distribute the knowledge of how to build it.<br>
><br>
> Kicking this off can be part of the job of the full-time officer of the organization. We've been doing pretty well with our classes at XinCheJian and I'd love to keep extending this educational effort.<br>
><br>
> Sponsoring hackerspace/open competitions for various focused topic challenges could be another good way for our organization to develop the general tech for the 100YSS.<br>
><br>
> The general sense I got from DARPA is that they'd rather have us develop collaboration instead of the competition. Although organizing competition instead of collaborative efforts is much easier to understand.<br>
><br>
> That said, there is a LOT of stuff DARPA will be looking for in a proposal, not the least of which is the financial/management aspect. I'm not qualified to do this part, but speak from experience with prior DARPA proposals. They look heavily at both the tech side and the can-they-actually-pull-this-off side -- oh yeah and the can-they-handle-the-FAR-accounting-requirements angle. I dont know if they need us to be FAR compliant. I hope not. That sucks up a huge chuck of the funding by itself.<br>
><br>
> I don't think FAR will enter the equation; we'll be a separate organization with very little links back to DARPA apart from checking that we're fulfilling our obligations. At least, that's the sense I get from reading the requirements.<br>
><br>
> I've just worked on a cash flow:<br>
><br>
> <a href="https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuPYJiOSewXLdEtTUGhSd3ZGQ0p6MmJfMzFoQzFLZ2c&hl=fr#gid=0" target="_blank">https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuPYJiOSewXLdEtTUGhSd3ZGQ0p6MmJfMzFoQzFLZ2c&hl=fr#gid=0</a><br>
><br>
> I think they'd be getting the best deal with us. Me and Min Lin Hsieh full-time with no salary - just covering our expenses. By the end of the two years at least 8 different organizations participating with funded projects using a majority of the original grant going to actually make concrete progress towards the long-term goals of the 100YSS.<br>
><br>
> (I'm sure some may find it icky that I'm putting myself as a full-time member of the organization but AFAIK there isn't that many people willing to float around the planet for the next two years without a salary. Even less finding two persons that have experience working as a team and complimentary interests and skillset ^_^ But feel free to argue with me on this if you don't like the idea.)<br>
><br>
> Lots to write up here to make it a full response.<br>
><br>
> Yes! Thanks for your help, much appreciated. I still have two days ahead of me so I think we can make it. I feel more confident now that I have a detailed cashflow.<br>
><br>
> Thanks,<br>
> --<br>
> ??? | Ricky Ng-Adam | <a href="http://xinchejian.com" target="_blank">http://xinchejian.com</a> | <a href="tel:%28%2B86%29%20186-2126-2521" value="+8618621262521" target="_blank">(+86) 186-2126-2521</a><br>
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Message: 2<br>
Date: Thu, 10 Nov 2011 08:48:01 +1100<br>
From: Paul Szymkowiak <<a href="mailto:paulszym%2Bcchs@gmail.com" target="_blank">paulszym+cchs@gmail.com</a>><br>
To: Hackerspaces Space Program communication list<br>
<<a href="mailto:spaceprogram@lists.hackerspaces.org" target="_blank">spaceprogram@lists.hackerspaces.org</a>><br>
Subject: Re: [SpaceProgram] 57 hours remaining to submit RFP for<br>
100YSS<br>
Message-ID:<br>
<CA+6RZaffV-HNV2HvCfAz9H8zeL=<a href="mailto:YFsPUiLGBkNmoXP2ED%2B9Ehg@mail.gmail.com" target="_blank">YFsPUiLGBkNmoXP2ED+9Ehg@mail.gmail.com</a>><br>
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="utf-8"<br>
<br>
Hi Ricky/ Jerry,<br>
<br>
I think Jerry has raised a number of great points, but particularly his<br>
points regarding the approach to education:<br>
<br>
One thought I had -- the program should have an educational component -<br>
> one to teach people helping in near term, and for much later when starship<br>
> is enroute. This is a multi-generational effort and we need to train<br>
> people up quickly. Perhaps we could sponsor some competitions to develop<br>
> focused self-taught/group classes in various Maker tech... rapid prototype<br>
> machines, 3d design for rapid manufacturing, microelectronics (arduino,<br>
> general electronics), troubleshooting, programming etc. The course<br>
> materials would be CC licensed and available through the organization to<br>
> further the development of other projects. We could/should have<br>
> educational component to most of the other projects so as to distribute the<br>
> knowledge of how to build it.<br>
><br>
<br>
Kicking this off can be part of the job of the full-time officer of the<br>
organization. We've been doing pretty well with our classes at XinCheJian<br>
and I'd love to keep extending this educational effort.<br>
<br>
<br>
Ricky, I think this is a key hackerspace differentiator, and an important<br>
response to 100YSS. What Jerry is talking about here needs to be a core<br>
part of the vision and plan now, not something to be kicked off later<br>
(although of course the *implementation* would be).<br>
<br>
This is a great vision of how hackerspaces fit the need, and I see two key<br>
elements here: 1) a truly open source, creative commons "from the ground<br>
up" maker education program, and 2) a maker education program that, from<br>
the outset, addresses the need for 100YSS to have *enroute*<br>
multi-generational learning and self-improvement to support ongoing<br>
development and discovery of new technologies.<br>
<br>
<br>
Cheers,<br>
<br>
<br>
Paul<br>
<br>
Paul Szymkowiak<br>
HackMelbourne.org <<a href="http://hackmelbourne.org/" target="_blank">http://hackmelbourne.org/</a>><br>
<a href="http://gplus.to/paulzee" target="_blank">gplus.to/paulzee</a><br>
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<<a href="http://twitter.com/smartenergywins" target="_blank">http://twitter.com/smartenergywins</a>><a href="http://twitter.com/hackmelbourne" target="_blank">twitter.com/hackmelbourne</a><br>
TimeZone: GMT +10 hours<br>
<br>
<br>
On 10 November 2011 08:12, Ricky Ng-Adam <<a href="mailto:rngadam@gmail.com" target="_blank">rngadam@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
<br>
> Hello Jerry!<br>
><br>
> On Thu, Nov 10, 2011 at 4:49 AM, Jerry Isdale <<a href="mailto:jerry@mauimakers.com" target="_blank">jerry@mauimakers.com</a>>wrote:<br>
><br>
>> Aloha<br>
>><br>
>> I've been remiss in putting some time to this effort. I looked at and<br>
>> edited the g-doc proposal a bit this AM. I added myself in the participant<br>
>> part and updated the MauiMakers section a bit. In the Sources of Funding<br>
>> section, I added Crowd-Sourced (eg Kickstarter) for specific projects.<br>
>><br>
><br>
> Good idea! The way I've got it setup right now is that we will have<br>
> regular distributions every 3 months to a new hackerspace to cover projects<br>
> to the amount of 30K$USD dollars. Obviously, additional funds to this would<br>
> be important and actually could be a good way to gauge how much support and<br>
> interest there is for a project. Perhaps a criteria before funding a<br>
> project out of the 100YSS.<br>
><br>
> One thought I had -- the program should have an educational component -<br>
>> one to teach people helping in near term, and for much later when starship<br>
>> is enroute. This is a multi-generational effort and we need to train<br>
>> people up quickly. Perhaps we could sponsor some competitions to develop<br>
>> focused self-taught/group classes in various Maker tech... rapid prototype<br>
>> machines, 3d design for rapid manufacturing, microelectronics (arduino,<br>
>> general electronics), troubleshooting, programming etc. The course<br>
>> materials would be CC licensed and available through the organization to<br>
>> further the development of other projects. We could/should have<br>
>> educational component to most of the other projects so as to distribute the<br>
>> knowledge of how to build it.<br>
>><br>
><br>
> Kicking this off can be part of the job of the full-time officer of the<br>
> organization. We've been doing pretty well with our classes at XinCheJian<br>
> and I'd love to keep extending this educational effort.<br>
><br>
> Sponsoring hackerspace/open competitions for various focused topic<br>
>> challenges could be another good way for our organization to develop the<br>
>> general tech for the 100YSS.<br>
>><br>
><br>
> The general sense I got from DARPA is that they'd rather have us develop<br>
> collaboration instead of the competition. Although organizing competition<br>
> instead of collaborative efforts is much easier to understand.<br>
><br>
><br>
>> That said, there is a LOT of stuff DARPA will be looking for in a<br>
>> proposal, not the least of which is the financial/management aspect. I'm<br>
>> not qualified to do this part, but speak from experience with prior DARPA<br>
>> proposals. They look heavily at both the tech side and the<br>
>> can-they-actually-pull-this-off side -- oh yeah and the<br>
>> can-they-handle-the-FAR-accounting-requirements angle. I dont know if they<br>
>> need us to be FAR compliant. I hope not. That sucks up a huge chuck of the<br>
>> funding by itself.<br>
>><br>
><br>
> I don't think FAR will enter the equation; we'll be a separate<br>
> organization with very little links back to DARPA apart from checking that<br>
> we're fulfilling our obligations. At least, that's the sense I get from<br>
> reading the requirements.<br>
><br>
> I've just worked on a cash flow:<br>
><br>
><br>
> <a href="https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuPYJiOSewXLdEtTUGhSd3ZGQ0p6MmJfMzFoQzFLZ2c&hl=fr#gid=0" target="_blank">https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AuPYJiOSewXLdEtTUGhSd3ZGQ0p6MmJfMzFoQzFLZ2c&hl=fr#gid=0</a><br>
><br>
><br>
> I think they'd be getting the best deal with us. Me and Min Lin Hsieh<br>
> full-time with no salary - just covering our expenses. By the end of the<br>
> two years at least 8 different organizations participating with funded<br>
> projects using a majority of the original grant going to actually make<br>
> concrete progress towards the long-term goals of the 100YSS.<br>
><br>
> (I'm sure some may find it icky that I'm putting myself as a full-time<br>
> member of the organization but AFAIK there isn't that many people willing<br>
> to float around the planet for the next two years without a salary. Even<br>
> less finding two persons that have experience working as a team and<br>
> complimentary interests and skillset ^_^ But feel free to argue with me on<br>
> this if you don't like the idea.)<br>
><br>
> Lots to write up here to make it a full response.<br>
>><br>
><br>
> Yes! Thanks for your help, much appreciated. I still have two days ahead<br>
> of me so I think we can make it. I feel more confident now that I have a<br>
> detailed cashflow.<br>
><br>
> Thanks,<br>
> --<br>
> ??? | Ricky Ng-Adam | <a href="http://xinchejian.com" target="_blank">http://xinchejian.com</a> | <a href="tel:%28%2B86%29%20186-2126-2521" value="+8618621262521" target="_blank">(+86) 186-2126-2521</a><br>
><br>
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